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#953889 --- 01/10/09 12:41 AM Boy wonder's own Democrats don't like plan
Samuel Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/07/08
Posts: 4495
Loc: Potter, NY
http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/01/09/democrats.stimulus/index.html

We are already trillions in debt. Let's add another trillion.

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#954157 --- 01/10/09 04:48 AM Re: Boy wonder's own Democrats don't like plan [Re: Samuel]
MorganHills Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/11/07
Posts: 1735
Loc: On a tangent
plan on alot of 'itchin and moanin about ANY plan to get this state and the country out of the mire we are stuck in. I suggest the whiners contact their elected officials to volunteer to do what they can to help turn things around on a local level. If they aren't willing, they should really just shuddup.


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#954182 --- 01/10/09 06:39 AM Re: Boy wonder's own Democrats don't like plan [Re: MorganHills]
LaughinWillow Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/12/01
Posts: 1950
Loc: State of Emergency
I don't like the plan either, but I'm surprised that people don't see what's going on here. This isn't an "economic rescue" package like they talk about - it's the government replacing the consumption of the American people. If no one replaces the consumption, these ruling elite parasites will have to admit their system is a failure and drastically change things. You're talking about a situation where these people would have to downsize the military (i.e. downsize their grip on the world's resources - ain't gonna happen), give up some significant percentage of their wealth, see a return to localized production and consumption (and, hence, local civic participation and control), face potential civil unrest from a countryfull of people who are used to getting whatever they want whenever they want it - CHEAP, etc etc. So rather than face reality, they have opted to simply spend the money THEMSELVES. And they're backed not only by the ruling elite in the US, but around the world, because the systems are so interconnected now. They'll fuel their OWN economy if you won't do it anymore. Anything but give up their iron grip on this planet.

I personally would LOVE to see this economic "rescue" fail miserably. I'd love for the legislative branch to have the "cahones" to tell Obama "not one more dime." Because that would move us all closer to freedom. But that's not their goal. They will do anything - ABSOLUTELY ANYTHING - to maintain this system. And they're putting on this "democrat vs. republican" show right now to ensure that the public keeps at each others' throats, because that helps them get away with what they're doing behind our backs. But it's all a show. In the end, it'll be 700 billion or a trillion or whatever - whatever they need to do to keep the money coming for the ruling elite. And we'll go back to buying China's toxic plastic garbage. And dumping it in the ocean 2 months later when it breaks.

God. Land of suckers.
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#954251 --- 01/10/09 12:07 PM Re: Boy wonder's own Democrats don't like plan [Re: LaughinWillow]
Mountain Man Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/27/07
Posts: 2432
Loc: out there
LaughingWilow: dead on right. It is not about anything other than preservation of what is accelerating into a caste system. We've got real problems.

I've said for a number of years that we were in trouble because we cannot support the means of production with our wages. Instead, we've supported it with personal credit. Too much personal credit.

Many, if not most Americans have overfilled their credit buckets. The allotment of available credit supported by incomes is finally overwhelmed. It had to happen. You can't fill it faster than you empty it and expect anything different to happen.

The real villains are congress and the lending industry. Congress has granted them all the room they need to charge interest rates that you and I would go to jail for if we tried to charge them to someone we might have loaned money to (sorry for the preposition at the end of the sentence).

I wonder if Obama and team doesn't already know that Americans have run out of discretionary income due to the above and lost wages? I wonder if they simply don't want to admit, as you say, that the self serving system they created has backfired on the establishment of wealth and power.

I have read we are finally saving money because we are finally scared as a people. Now that we are doing it, they don't like it.

We might be in more trouble than we know.
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Some people never go crazy, What truly horrible lives they must live--Charles Bukowski

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#954451 --- 01/10/09 03:49 PM Re: Boy wonder's own Democrats don't like plan [Re: Mountain Man]
VM Smith Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 11/29/05
Posts: 38160
Loc: Ship of Fools
"sorry for the preposition at the end of the sentence"

Don't apologize; you're in excellent company. I don't think the following is necessarily apocryphal; it seems quintessentially Churchillian:

"If you're a Winston Churchill fan, you no doubt recognize my post title. Although it may well be apocrypal, many grammarians (or perhaps I should say "grammar rebels") tell of the day Churchill received a manuscript back from his publishing company, only to discover that some editor had turned one of his more elegant sentences into a garbled mess in order to avoid leaving a preposition at the end. The affronted Churchill returned the manuscript after writing a pungent message: "This is something up with which I will not put.""

"The real villains are congress and the lending industry. Congress has granted them all the room they need to charge interest rates that you and I would go to jail"

Congress then compounded the insult by changing the bankruptcy laws to favor their financial industry buddies/campaign contributors.

"I've said for a number of years that we were in trouble because we cannot support the means of production with our wages."

That's the nub of the problem. They've forgotten what H. Ford knew when he instituted the (then very high) $5/day wage: If you don't pay them, they can't buy your product.

"We might be in more trouble than we know."

We have been for quite some time. Now people are catching on, but the train's already left the station.



Edited by VM Smith (01/10/09 03:53 PM)
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If you vote for government, you have no right to complain about what government does.

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#954808 --- 01/10/09 10:59 PM Re: Boy wonder's own Democrats don't like plan [Re: VM Smith]
Samuel Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/07/08
Posts: 4495
Loc: Potter, NY
Awesome responses. Glad to see that a few people see that the hole we are in is not from George Bush and we WILL NOT be rescued by Obama's big "change." People need to pay their bills, pay their credit cards off and save money. A natural economy, not a stimulus is what is needed. The US can not buy their way out of a recession.

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#955162 --- 01/11/09 05:44 PM Re: Boy wonder's own Democrats don't like plan [Re: Samuel]
american girl Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/19/05
Posts: 3511
Loc: ny
That is what I am trying to do! (pay off my bills and credit cards) the honest way....but, if I WERE to get another stimulus check, I would put it on my credit card debt, just like the last one! They aren't going to sucker me into "stimulating the economy", that's what got me in this mess in the first place!


Edited by american girl (01/11/09 05:44 PM)
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#956023 --- 01/12/09 03:46 PM Re: Boy wonder's own Democrats don't like plan [Re: american girl]
Samuel Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/07/08
Posts: 4495
Loc: Potter, NY
Originally Posted By: american girl
That is what I am trying to do! (pay off my bills and credit cards) the honest way....but, if I WERE to get another stimulus check, I would put it on my credit card debt, just like the last one! They aren't going to sucker me into "stimulating the economy", that's what got me in this mess in the first place!


Smart girl. Take all those credit cards and make a plan to pay them off with your tax return and this "stimulus" check. All the upcoming liberal handouts will prove to dig a deeper hole to those who take them with a big smile and vote for the politicians who handed them out.

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#956084 --- 01/12/09 05:21 PM Re: Boy wonder's own Democrats don't like plan [Re: Samuel]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
hahahaha

I'll do the same thing with this one as I did with the last one - the "conservative one" - and plop half in wedding savings and half on student loans.
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#956127 --- 01/12/09 06:25 PM Re: Boy wonder's own Democrats don't like plan [Re: past tense]
reilley Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 01/18/05
Posts: 11744
Loc: between here and there
only a 'few' blew the money .....
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