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#931831 --- 12/05/08 05:33 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: Gio]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32621
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Gio
I do not understand why they have not shut them completely down. They still are breaking the law.


To give the tribe time to calm down before they lose.
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#931838 --- 12/05/08 05:38 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: bluezone]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: sworldt
By the way trump in case u care. I have absolutely NO interest in the Cayuga Nation in any way.I don't smoke and i don' drive from Auburn to buy gas nor do i have any relatives enrolled in the tribe. In case u were wondering.


But sworldt was pushing for an indian casino in Auburn.
More lost tax money.............................


Where is Okla?



.


BZ if your going to tell a story get it straight. Seneca - Cayugas not Cayuga Nation. As you already know ALL TAXES were to be paid along with MILLIONS to the county and local GOV. thousands of jobs. But your right who needs it we are doing so great here. What was i thinking. I'm so glad you UCE nuts help stop it.
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#931841 --- 12/05/08 05:40 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: Rich_Tallcot]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32621
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Rich_Tallcot
Letter to the editor:

Upstate Citizens for Equality extends a sincere thank you and appreciation to District Attorneys Richard Swinehart and Jon Budelmann and Sheriffs Jack Stenberg and David Gould for implementing a superbly coordinated uneventful raid.




You also deserve a sincere thank you for looking out for NY taxpayers. Paterson should take note.



.
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#931896 --- 12/05/08 06:17 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: grinch
It is very clear the Cayuga do not have land in trust.
To proof that out they have been paying land taxes that come due on their land. The tribe has not exerted political control of land in this area for more than 200 years and repurchasing land does not reinstate that political control.

They are or should be treated as any other merchant who does not collect and remit sales and use tax.


The Cayuga could have applied for grants, tax abatements, Empire zone status etc just as Goulds and other merchants have done.

The Sherrill decision was clear and explicit, a tribe cannot just purchase land and declare it sovereign. That is what the Cayuga attempted to do. The hearing the other day zeroed in on that question.

I question whether Walmart is allowed to keep sales tax money. I read that statement somewhere before.do you have a reference source that can confirm that?



You danced around the post and what it said. However Wal-Mart is not the only retailer and it was in the news appr. 1 month ago. You can go look if you want.


I am not going to go look for something a month old that I doubt exists or you mis-interpreted the article. Since you know all about it why don't you find it and post it on here?


Whats wrong afraid you might be wrong. I don't care i have nothing to prove to nobody. This is my opinion don't be so lazy and do your own work.


Now it is not a fact that Wal-Mart withholds taxes but only your opinion? You are right about one thing. You can't prove nothing to nobody! LOL
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#931904 --- 12/05/08 06:23 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: trump]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: grinch
It is very clear the Cayuga do not have land in trust.
To proof that out they have been paying land taxes that come due on their land. The tribe has not exerted political control of land in this area for more than 200 years and repurchasing land does not reinstate that political control.

They are or should be treated as any other merchant who does not collect and remit sales and use tax.


The Cayuga could have applied for grants, tax abatements, Empire zone status etc just as Goulds and other merchants have done.

The Sherrill decision was clear and explicit, a tribe cannot just purchase land and declare it sovereign. That is what the Cayuga attempted to do. The hearing the other day zeroed in on that question.

I question whether Walmart is allowed to keep sales tax money. I read that statement somewhere before.do you have a reference source that can confirm that?



You danced around the post and what it said. However Wal-Mart is not the only retailer and it was in the news appr. 1 month ago. You can go look if you want.


I am not going to go look for something a month old that I doubt exists or you mis-interpreted the article. Since you know all about it why don't you find it and post it on here?


Whats wrong afraid you might be wrong. I don't care i have nothing to prove to nobody. This is my opinion don't be so lazy and do your own work.


Now it is not a fact that Wal-Mart withholds taxes but only your opinion? You are right about one thing. You can't prove nothing to nobody! LOL


Nice try but as usual your a bit short. If i remember correctly they finding the state allows retailers to withold a certain percentage of sales tax. Problem now is it is mounting to millions. You find the article i have better things to do. bye bye
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#931907 --- 12/05/08 06:27 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: grinch
It is very clear the Cayuga do not have land in trust.
To proof that out they have been paying land taxes that come due on their land. The tribe has not exerted political control of land in this area for more than 200 years and repurchasing land does not reinstate that political control.

They are or should be treated as any other merchant who does not collect and remit sales and use tax.


The Cayuga could have applied for grants, tax abatements, Empire zone status etc just as Goulds and other merchants have done.

The Sherrill decision was clear and explicit, a tribe cannot just purchase land and declare it sovereign. That is what the Cayuga attempted to do. The hearing the other day zeroed in on that question.

I question whether Walmart is allowed to keep sales tax money. I read that statement somewhere before.do you have a reference source that can confirm that?



You danced around the post and what it said. However Wal-Mart is not the only retailer and it was in the news appr. 1 month ago. You can go look if you want.


I am not going to go look for something a month old that I doubt exists or you mis-interpreted the article. Since you know all about it why don't you find it and post it on here?


Whats wrong afraid you might be wrong. I don't care i have nothing to prove to nobody. This is my opinion don't be so lazy and do your own work.


Now it is not a fact that Wal-Mart withholds taxes but only your opinion? You are right about one thing. You can't prove nothing to nobody! LOL


Nice try but as usual your a bit short. If i remember correctly they finding the state allows retailers to withold a certain percentage of sales tax. Problem now is it is mounting to millions. You find the article i have better things to do. bye bye


If you remember correctly? LOL Now that is funny. I say you don't remember correctly.
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#931908 --- 12/05/08 06:28 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
trump: does this mean i'm off your xmas list. I'm crushed. lmao
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#931911 --- 12/05/08 06:29 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sworldt
trump: does this mean i'm off your xmas list. I'm crushed. lmao


What it means is that you throw out outlandish statements on here and expect me to bite by going on a wild goose chase. Better luck next time.
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#931915 --- 12/05/08 06:31 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: trump]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Your opinion your entitled to it. lol
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#931917 --- 12/05/08 06:32 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Your opinion your entitled to it. lol


Man you are so stupid you make HarleyBob look smart.
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#931922 --- 12/05/08 06:36 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: trump]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Your opinion your entitled to it. lol


Man you are so stupid you make HarleyBob look smart.


Don't you believe in the right to hold your own opinion. Name calling getting desperate are you. Don't worry i still love u
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#931928 --- 12/05/08 06:42 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Your opinion your entitled to it. lol


Man you are so stupid you make HarleyBob look smart.


Don't you believe in the right to hold your own opinion. Name calling getting desperate are you. Don't worry i still love u


I am getting not desperate but very frustrated with you. You mix opinion with fact. First you said that Wal-mart withheld taxes. That sounds like a fact that you know? Now you sound like it is your opinion? You are a waste of time.
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#931943 --- 12/05/08 06:54 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: Gio]
Rich_Tallcot Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 5568
Loc: Greeneville, TN
Originally Posted By: Gio
I do not understand why they have not shut them completely down. They still are breaking the law.
The specific law of possession is the most clear cut violation to deal with and therefore the easiest to set precedent with. The tribe is claiming sovereignty over the lands they purchased on the open market. The STATE refuses to enforce the laws as applied to tribes. By leading off with a case that is clear cut, local law enforcement can proceed to have the courts rule that local jurisdiction applies. Once that ruling comes down, Lakeside will either have to comply with the same laws that apply to everyone else or they will be shut down.

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#931991 --- 12/05/08 08:46 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: trump]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Your opinion your entitled to it. lol


Man you are so stupid you make HarleyBob look smart.


Don't you believe in the right to hold your own opinion. Name calling getting desperate are you. Don't worry i still love u


I am getting not desperate but very frustrated with you. You mix opinion with fact. First you said that Wal-mart withheld taxes. That sounds like a fact that you know? Now you sound like it is your opinion? You are a waste of time.


It is fact however you tried to get me to chase an article for you.I'm not your lacky do your own research. you have a good night now. Don't get so upset life is too short.
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#931997 --- 12/05/08 08:51 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
reilley Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 11744
Loc: between here and there
sworldt, save your fingers ... they are like arguing with a 3 year old. They will never make sense,cause they have no common sense.
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#932000 --- 12/05/08 08:54 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: reilley]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: reilley
sworldt, save your fingers ... they are like arguing with a 3 year old. They will never make sense,cause they have no common sense.


Yea i know,but i believe in miracles. lol
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#932042 --- 12/05/08 10:28 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
Rich_Tallcot Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 5568
Loc: Greeneville, TN
Hello Sworldt - I see you are posting under your old handle again. I recall you were caught a few years back using more than one. I see your buddy Dilliner in the Seneca-Cayuga tribe is in a pickle. Imagine that? The old chief didn't even understand the full aspects of tribal sovereign immunity. But that's what all tribal members deal with because they have no Constitutional rights.

As for all sides coming together or it being handed down to our kids? I'd ask what you've been smoking, but you don't smoke. Ahh, maybe it's flashbacks.

Yes Sworldt, we did all come together in June of 2005 and worked everything out. UCE had a celebration party. I guess you missed it. What's the matter? Didn't your team have a party?

Or did you mean "this mess" pertaining to the thread, which deals with criminal possession of cigarettes. There's nothing to come together on Sworldt. The Cayuga tribe is no different than any other criminal that tries to defend themselves in court.

You were ALWAYS great on predicting how the tribe was going to win the land claim, or predicting that the Seneca-Cayuga tribe was going to get their casino on in Aurelius, then Auburn, then Throop, then Rochester or the Cayuga tribe get a casino in the Catskills. Do you have any predictions on how Judge Fisher is going to rule?

No, this case will be done with all appeals exhausted in less than a year. UCE is not going to get you. I'm sorry that you still feel paranoid. We disagree, but I have nothing against you.

As to Walmart or any retail outlet keeping part of the sales tax, the state allows EVERY retail store to keep a percentage to cover the cost of bookkeeping and remitting the tax. The tribe could too if it complied with the law. There seems to be a lot in this world you don't know about. Yes, even Tallcot Bookshop kept a cut. Not only that, but the state has recently increased the allowance.

"Wasn't the state suppose to provide coupons to the tribes for collection of taxes and was that ever done?( no )"

This is not about the tribal members not being allowed to purchase tax free cigarettes. You're confused, as usual.

"Wasn't there a court order in place NOT to attempt collection from the tribes till Paterson negotiated this issue with the tribes."

There was a court order in place not to enforce the law that contained that provision. But the court order did not apply to the law in place previously nor would it apply to the possessions charge.

The laws regarding possession and tax collection are two different law. Furthermore, the Lakeside businesses are not on reservation lands, are under local jurisdiction, and have to comply with ALL laws. Even all tribal members have to pay the taxes on cigarettes there. Their only exclusion for not paying the taxes is on their own qualified reservations.

It's only clear if you actually read the law.

By the way - Patterson met with the Seneca and Oneida tribes today in Manhattan and all sides are claiming the meetings were productive. I'd be willing to BET that the tribes took a wake up call when the Cayuga got raided. I'll bet they make a deal. But I'll ALSO bet that the tribes won't comply with any deal they make. I can SEEEEEE the propaganda machines running now, how the tribes are saving New York State as the good neighbors they are. Choke.

From the Cayuga ruling: "We understand Sherrill to hold that equitable doctrines, such as laches, acquiescence, and impossibility, can, in appropriate circumstances, be applied to Indian land claims"

"The broadness of the Supreme Court's statements indicates to us that Sherrill's holding is not narrowly limited to claims identical to that brought by the Oneidas, seeking a revival of sovereignty, but rather, that these equitable defenses apply to "disruptive" Indian land claims more generally."

"We emphasize that plaintiffs' claim is and has always been one sounding in ejectment; plaintiffs have asserted a continuing right to immediate possession as the basis of all of their claims, and have always sought ejectment of the current landowners as their preferred form of relief."

"As noted above, in their complaint in this case the Cayugas seek "immediate possession" of the land in question and ejectment of the current residents. Indeed, the District Court noted early in the litigation that it was "clear" that the complaint "presents a possessory claim, basically in ejectment." Cayuga I, 565 F. Supp. at 1317

"Plaintiffs urge us to conclude that as a legal remedy, ejectment is not subject to equitable defenses."

"we see no reason why the equitable principles identified by the Supreme Court in Sherrill should not apply to this case."

CASE CLOSED. ALL SIDES HAVE COME TOGETHER.

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#932183 --- 12/06/08 07:32 AM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: reilley]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: reilley
sworldt, save your fingers ... they are like arguing with a 3 year old. They will never make sense,cause they have no common sense.


Reilley, I am flabbergasted. If you have read all that has been posted about Indians not paying taxes and you still don't understand that we have to pay more taxes because the Indians don't pay taxes, then I guess you will never understand. I find that quite amazing.
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#932188 --- 12/06/08 07:46 AM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: Rich_Tallcot]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Rich_Tallcot

As to Walmart or any retail outlet keeping part of the sales tax, the state allows EVERY retail store to keep a percentage to cover the cost of bookkeeping and remitting the tax. The tribe could too if it complied with the law. There seems to be a lot in this world you don't know about. Yes, even Tallcot Bookshop kept a cut. Not only that, but the state has recently increased the allowance.


Is that what Sworldt is talking about? OMG. I know for a small business I am familiar with they keep 5% up to $200 maximum of the NY sales tax for doing all the paperwork. What a joke if that is what he is referring to! As you said, the Indians could get the same cut also IF they paid sales taxes.
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#932194 --- 12/06/08 08:11 AM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32621
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sworldt


BZ if your going to tell a story get it straight. Seneca - Cayugas not Cayuga Nation.



Would that not be an indian casino in auburn?
You were willing to sell out Auburn for an out of state tribe with no claim to any NY land?



Originally Posted By: sworldt

As you already know ALL TAXES were to be paid along with MILLIONS to the county and local GOV. thousands of jobs. But your right who needs it we are doing so great here. What was i thinking. I'm so glad you UCE nuts help stop it.


Did the SC tribe ever submit that report that Sennett and Auburn asked for?


.
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