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#932641 --- 12/07/08 07:26 AM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: reilley]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: reilley
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: reilley
sworldt, save your fingers ... they are like arguing with a 3 year old. They will never make sense,cause they have no common sense.


Reilley, I am flabbergasted. If you have read all that has been posted about Indians not paying taxes and you still don't understand that we have to pay more taxes because the Indians don't pay taxes, then I guess you will never understand. I find that quite amazing.

.......................
Oh believe me I UNDERSTAND EVERYTHING that has been said on here.
I understand taxes and the government alot better than you think.


Your post above tells me you understand nothing. Have you ever taken a course in Economics? in high school or college? I don't see how you could of and believe what you do.

Suppose the Indians had a football team and played the Buffalo Bills. When the Indians scored a touchdown, they got 7 points. When the Bills got a touchdown, they got to keep 5 points and had to give 2 points to the government. Would that be fair? Of course not. You need a level playing field in football and in every business endeavor.
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#932649 --- 12/07/08 07:32 AM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
sworldt did you get any money from Spicer?


http://seneca-cayugatribeofoklahoma.org/blog/pgs/0607.htm



.


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#932660 --- 12/07/08 07:55 AM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
My main concern is this might come back and bite us all in the a-- in the form of a law suit. U & I will have to pay.


Don't be concerned about that. Be concerned about all of the legitmate buisnesses that were paying their fair share of taxes that Lakeside put out of busines by Lakeside undercutting them and not paying their fair share of taxes! How the heck hard is that to understand? \:\(


So you don't care if the tax payers get stuck with a huge law suit. How does it feel to be rich enough not to be concerned with money. Me i have been a blue collar worker and proud of it right up to my disability. As to the other business's i do believe it is called competition. The american Way. How many mom and pops did Wal-Mart put under.


I am not rich. A huge law suit that the Indians would win is laughable. In todays Rochester D&C paper, there is a letter on the editorial page by the staff of the paper about the raids. They say the state government should be collecting taxes from the Indians. Only a few radicals like you believe otherwise anymore.

Wal-Mart started as a mom and pop operation by Sam Walton in Arkansas. It grew big because it was good at providing a service the customer wanted and it followed all the rules of business and government. Maybe someday the government will have to break it up for being too big as the government broke up the phone company for being a monopoly.

The Indians, on the other hand, are attempting to grow by violating the rules we should all be livng under and they are putting numerous mom and pop operations out of business as they do it.


Edited by trump (12/07/08 11:36 AM)
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#932695 --- 12/07/08 09:04 AM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: bluezone]
Rich_Tallcot Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 5565
Loc: Greeneville, TN
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: sworldt

My main concern is this might come back and bite us all in the a-- in the form of a law suit. U & I will have to pay.
But you do not mind losing over 30+ million of sales tax dollars per year from just these 2 smokeshops?

Good one BZ! Evidently Sworldt thinks lawsuits cost over 30 million dollars a year.
Oh, and your other posts about the tribes owing a billion dollars is a little light - that's a billion dollars A YEAR.
The Cayuga Land Claim wasn't cheap, but the 25 year cost to to the state was about 3 million. Money well spent.
I'm glad Sworldt helped pay for it. LOL

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#932777 --- 12/07/08 11:51 AM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: Rich_Tallcot]
reilley Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 11744
Loc: between here and there
The Buffalo Bills ? ....you couldn't pick a better team?
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#932782 --- 12/07/08 11:56 AM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: reilley]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: reilley
The Buffalo Bills ? ....you couldn't pick a better team?


I assume you understand that the other team is beside the point. In discussing the Indian situation, it is often said we need a level playing field. That is as true in business as in football. Either everybody pays taxes or nobody pays taxes. You should not pay or pay based on your ancestry. That is ridiculous.
That is damaging to our free enterprise system of capitalism.


Edited by trump (12/07/08 12:16 PM)
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#933024 --- 12/07/08 06:37 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: trump]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: reilley
The Buffalo Bills ? ....you couldn't pick a better team?


I assume you understand that the other team is beside the point. In discussing the Indian situation, it is often said we need a level playing field. That is as true in business as in football. Either everybody pays taxes or nobody pays taxes. You should not pay or pay based on your ancestry. That is ridiculous.
That is damaging to our free enterprise system of capitalism.


Do you believe everybody should pay the same with no excuses?
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#933025 --- 12/07/08 06:39 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: trump]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: reilley
The Buffalo Bills ? ....you couldn't pick a better team?


I assume you understand that the other team is beside the point. In discussing the Indian situation, it is often said we need a level playing field. That is as true in business as in football. Either everybody pays taxes or nobody pays taxes. You should not pay or pay based on your ancestry. That is ridiculous.
That is damaging to our free enterprise system of capitalism.


Reilley you think i hit a nerve? Maybe there is some truth to the idea.
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#933028 --- 12/07/08 06:42 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: bluezone]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: bluezone
sworldt did you get any money from Spicer?


http://seneca-cayugatribeofoklahoma.org/blog/pgs/0607.htm



.




I have answered this before,but understanding your a bit slow. I have NOT rec'd any money or promises from nobody. I am not the one with a TAX EXEMPT ORGANIZATION complaining about those who don't pay taxes. Your thinking of the UCE. What a joke.
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#933030 --- 12/07/08 06:43 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: reilley
The Buffalo Bills ? ....you couldn't pick a better team?


I assume you understand that the other team is beside the point. In discussing the Indian situation, it is often said we need a level playing field. That is as true in business as in football. Either everybody pays taxes or nobody pays taxes. You should not pay or pay based on your ancestry. That is ridiculous.
That is damaging to our free enterprise system of capitalism.


Do you believe everybody should pay the same with no excuses?


I am not sure what you are driving at but off hand I can't think of any excuses, can you?
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#933037 --- 12/07/08 06:45 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: reilley
The Buffalo Bills ? ....you couldn't pick a better team?


I assume you understand that the other team is beside the point. In discussing the Indian situation, it is often said we need a level playing field. That is as true in business as in football. Either everybody pays taxes or nobody pays taxes. You should not pay or pay based on your ancestry. That is ridiculous.
That is damaging to our free enterprise system of capitalism.


Reilley you think i hit a nerve? Maybe there is some truth to the idea.


I don't know what nerve you think you hit. I don't know what idea you are talking about?
_________________________
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#933041 --- 12/07/08 06:48 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: bluezone]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Rich_Tallcot
... but I thought you'd keep up because during the 25 years war the Seneca-Cayuga tribe allowed you access to their tribal forum board...


Is that why sworldt has always sided with the tribes?

it is a disgrace that he has the american flag as his avatar.


.


I'll tell you what jerk. I fought for that flag and watched many of my friends blown to hell and gone for it. What have you contributed besides bullsh-- on this forum. The worst part about this is it took people like me to give YOU the right to speak your piece. So go ahead you have the right,but don't ever forget who helped protect that right for you.
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#933045 --- 12/07/08 06:51 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: trump]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: reilley
The Buffalo Bills ? ....you couldn't pick a better team?


I assume you understand that the other team is beside the point. In discussing the Indian situation, it is often said we need a level playing field. That is as true in business as in football. Either everybody pays taxes or nobody pays taxes. You should not pay or pay based on your ancestry. That is ridiculous.
That is damaging to our free enterprise system of capitalism.


Do you believe everybody should pay the same with no excuses?


I am not sure what you are driving at but off hand I can't think of any excuses, can you?


I agree as i said before. Give me a group that wants to end tax loop holes for EVERYONE EQUALLY and i might be intersted. Now tell the UCE. Have you read about the seneca land fill,goulds pumps and the list gos on.
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#933046 --- 12/07/08 06:53 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: trump]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: reilley
The Buffalo Bills ? ....you couldn't pick a better team?


I assume you understand that the other team is beside the point. In discussing the Indian situation, it is often said we need a level playing field. That is as true in business as in football. Either everybody pays taxes or nobody pays taxes. You should not pay or pay based on your ancestry. That is ridiculous.
That is damaging to our free enterprise system of capitalism.


Reilley you think i hit a nerve? Maybe there is some truth to the idea.


I don't know what nerve you think you hit. I don't know what idea you are talking about?


Talking about the UCE being paid by non indian casino owners.
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#933050 --- 12/07/08 06:54 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: reilley
The Buffalo Bills ? ....you couldn't pick a better team?


I assume you understand that the other team is beside the point. In discussing the Indian situation, it is often said we need a level playing field. That is as true in business as in football. Either everybody pays taxes or nobody pays taxes. You should not pay or pay based on your ancestry. That is ridiculous.
That is damaging to our free enterprise system of capitalism.


Do you believe everybody should pay the same with no excuses?


I am not sure what you are driving at but off hand I can't think of any excuses, can you?


I agree as i said before. Give me a group that wants to end tax loop holes for EVERYONE EQUALLY and i might be intersted. Now tell the UCE. Have you read about the seneca land fill,goulds pumps and the list gos on.


I have already replied that I am not real happy about tax breaks and bailouts for Seneca Meadows, Goulds Pumps, etc but at least they were done by some level of government legally as opposed to the Indians simply breaking the law. Do you even read what I post? And if the Indians were not breaking the law UCE could go out of business because there would be no need for that organization any more.
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#933056 --- 12/07/08 06:58 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: reilley
The Buffalo Bills ? ....you couldn't pick a better team?


I assume you understand that the other team is beside the point. In discussing the Indian situation, it is often said we need a level playing field. That is as true in business as in football. Either everybody pays taxes or nobody pays taxes. You should not pay or pay based on your ancestry. That is ridiculous.
That is damaging to our free enterprise system of capitalism.


Reilley you think i hit a nerve? Maybe there is some truth to the idea.


I don't know what nerve you think you hit. I don't know what idea you are talking about?


Talking about the UCE being paid by non indian casino owners.


I am not a fan of gambling. I think it causes a lot of problems for people who get addicted to it. I think there are entirely too many casinos already in this country


Edited by trump (12/07/08 07:04 PM)
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#933067 --- 12/07/08 07:06 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: trump]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: reilley
The Buffalo Bills ? ....you couldn't pick a better team?


I assume you understand that the other team is beside the point. In discussing the Indian situation, it is often said we need a level playing field. That is as true in business as in football. Either everybody pays taxes or nobody pays taxes. You should not pay or pay based on your ancestry. That is ridiculous.
That is damaging to our free enterprise system of capitalism.


Do you believe everybody should pay the same with no excuses?


I am not sure what you are driving at but off hand I can't think of any excuses, can you?


I agree as i said before. Give me a group that wants to end tax loop holes for EVERYONE EQUALLY and i might be intersted. Now tell the UCE. Have you read about the seneca land fill,goulds pumps and the list gos on.


I have already replied that I am not real happy about tax breaks and bailouts for Seneca Meadows, Goulds Pumps, etc but at least they were done by some level of government legally as opposed to the Indians simply breaking the law. Do you even read what I post? And if the Indians were not breaking the law UCE could go out of business because there would be no need for that organization any more.


That is the whole argument. The indians say they are NOT breaking the law. The UCE wants to change the laws.The local Gov. says the tribes are breaking the laws. So whos right. I'm no expert in indian law as they date back to beginning of this country. The UCE as they first started were a group of land owners locked out by their own goverment.When the Cayugas threatened them with eviction i sided with the UCE.But over the years they mutated from protecting their land to attacking the tribes. Thats when i said wait isn't there a better way to handle all this.About 4 years ago. So i stand saying instead of violating anyones rights lets try to end this through economic development together.The same that has been used many times in other places. The UCE don't want peace they want REVENGE at all cost.


Edited by sworldt (12/07/08 07:08 PM)
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#933073 --- 12/07/08 07:10 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: trump]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: reilley
The Buffalo Bills ? ....you couldn't pick a better team?


I assume you understand that the other team is beside the point. In discussing the Indian situation, it is often said we need a level playing field. That is as true in business as in football. Either everybody pays taxes or nobody pays taxes. You should not pay or pay based on your ancestry. That is ridiculous.
That is damaging to our free enterprise system of capitalism.


Reilley you think i hit a nerve? Maybe there is some truth to the idea.


I don't know what nerve you think you hit. I don't know what idea you are talking about?


Talking about the UCE being paid by non indian casino owners.


I am not a fan of gambling. I think it causes a lot of problems for people who get addicted to it. I think there are entirely too many casinos already in this country


I also don't gamble. I tried it but found it boring.But i do believe this is a free country and it should be left to the individual to decide for them self. who are we to tell someone else how to live or whats good for them.


Edited by sworldt (12/07/08 07:11 PM)
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#933075 --- 12/07/08 07:15 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: sworldt]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: sworldt

That is the whole argument. The indians say they are NOT breaking the law. The UCE wants to change the laws.The local Gov. says the tribes are breaking the laws. So whos right. I'm no expert in indian law as they date back to beginning of this country. The UCE as they first started were a group of land owners locked out by their own goverment.When the Cayugas threatened them with eviction i sided with the UCE.But over the years they mutated from protecting their land to attacking the tribes. Thats when i said wait isn't there a better way to handle all this.About 4 years ago. So i stand saying instead of violating anyones rights lets try to end this through economic development together.The same that has been used many times in other places. The UCE don't want peace they want REVENGE at all cost.


I dont see the UCE as wanting to change the laws. They just want the laws enforced that already exist!

It is not only the local government that says the tribes are breaking the law. It is also said by our local senators and assemblymen. The Rochester D&C editorial board said so today. I think the vast majority of people now agree the tribes are breaking the law. Yet higher levels of government refuse to act for some reason. I don't see the UCE wanting revenge and not peace. The tribes already owe the government a huge amount of money on back taxes that I am sure we will never collect. I don't see it as revenge to try and put illegal operations out of business. Someplace on there forums someone posted a few days ago about the state taxation department putting out of business a bar in Syracuse for not paying their taxes. That is often done to businesses not paying their taxes. I don't see the Indians as any different.


Edited by trump (12/07/08 07:20 PM)
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#933082 --- 12/07/08 07:24 PM Re: Decision Delayed in Indian Tax Case [Re: trump]
sworldt Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/04
Posts: 2163
Loc: Auburn,NY
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: sworldt

That is the whole argument. The indians say they are NOT breaking the law. The UCE wants to change the laws.The local Gov. says the tribes are breaking the laws. So whos right. I'm no expert in indian law as they date back to beginning of this country. The UCE as they first started were a group of land owners locked out by their own goverment.When the Cayugas threatened them with eviction i sided with the UCE.But over the years they mutated from protecting their land to attacking the tribes. Thats when i said wait isn't there a better way to handle all this.About 4 years ago. So i stand saying instead of violating anyones rights lets try to end this through economic development together.The same that has been used many times in other places. The UCE don't want peace they want REVENGE at all cost.


It is not only the local government that says the tribes are breaking the law. It is also said by our local senators and assemblymen. The Rochester D&C editorial board said so today. I think the vast majority of people now agree the tribes are breaking the law. Yet higher levels of government refuse to act for some reason. I don't see the UCE wanting revenge and not peace. The tribes already owe the government a huge amount of money on back taxes that I am sure we will never collect. I don't see it as revenge to try and put illegal operations out of business. Someplace on there forums someone posted a few days ago about the state taxation department putting out of business a bar in Syracuse for not paying their taxes. That is often done to businesses not paying their taxes. I don't see the Indians as any different.


As you said at a state level. Theres the rub cause it is at a FEDERAL level the tribes are operating.The same as NY State or any other state. The same if the cayugas are given trust status on their land it will be the federal goverment controlling it not the local gov..This whole issue is very complicated no matter what anybody tries to tell you.I see this from both sides and i do believe unless the people come together we won't see this come to an end.That is why i have attempted to bring the seneca cayugas and the local gov. together in the past,but it won't happen.
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