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#923937 --- 11/24/08 10:01 AM Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad
Strawberry Jam Offline
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Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY
MILITARY: Pentagon reaffirms denial of highest medal to Marine
Camp Pendleton Sgt. Rafael Peralta died during 2004 Fallujah battle

By TERI FIGUEROA - Staff Writer | Wednesday, November 19, 2008 7:31 PM PST ∞



The Department of Defense has reaffirmed its decision not to award the Medal of Honor to Sgt. Rafael Peralta, a Camp Pendleton Marine who witnesses say threw himself on a grenade to save his colleagues in Fallujah, Iraq in 2004.

U.S. Rep. Duncan Hunter said Wednesday he was disappointed by the decision to award Peralta the Navy Cross instead.

Read the Secretary of Defense letter and the Congressional letter to the President.

"Clearly, Sergeant Peralta deserves the Medal of Honor," Hunter, R-Alpine, said in a written statement.

George Sagba, an attorney for Peralta's family, said the family intends to push its appeal after President-elect Barack Obama appoints a new defense secretary.

The battle over whether Peralta should receive the nation's highest military honor came down to differing interpretations of whether the 25-year-old consciously pulled the grenade underneath his dying body to absorb the coming explosion to protect fellow troops, as eyewitnesses said he did.

The Pentagon's decision in September to award Peralta the Navy Cross, the second-highest military honor, caused a furor among Peralta's friends and family, and prompted San Diego County's congressional delegation and California's two U.S. senators to ask President Bush to review the decision.

In a letter to Hunter dated Tuesday, Secretary of Defense Robert Gates said that five independent experts reviewed the evidence and found it did not meet the required standard.

"After careful consideration, I concurred with this conclusion," Gates wrote.

Gates said he'd been asked by Bush to respond to the letter from the congressional delegation.

Peralta's mother, who lives in San Diego, said Wednesday that the decision to deny her son the Medal of Honor was unjust.

"I want him (Gates) to explain to me what his doubt is," Rosa Peralta said. "What doubt does he have? I want an explanation."

A San Diego resident when he joined the Marines, Peralta died Nov. 15, 2004, when he and fellow Marines attached to Camp Pendleton's 1st Marine Division attacked three insurgents inside a house in Fallujah during one of the largest battles of the Iraq war.

Peralta had been wounded by an accidental shot to the head from another Marine and was on the floor when the grenade was tossed into the room.

The Marines with Peralta that day say they saw him reach out with his right arm and drag the grenade to his body moments before it exploded.

In his statement Wednesday, Hunter pointed to those witness accounts in arguing that Peralta deserved the Medal of Honor.

"In matter of fact, many awards for valor in the history of our military have been given for actions which represented the last, fleeting moments of life that, even after medical examination left experts wondering how someone could possibly do what they did," Hunter said. "The answer has always been to trust their comrades in arms and eyewitness accounts.

"In Sergeant Peralta's case, we should do no less."

Staff Writer Edward Sifuentes and the Associated Press contributed to this report.

Contact staff writer Teri Figueroa at (760) 740-5442 or tfigueroa@nctimes.com.




Statement from U.S. Congressman Duncan Hunter (R-CA):

“I am disappointed in Secretary Gates’ decision. I am disappointed because eye witness accounts from Marines involved in the firefight clearly indicate that Sergeant Peralta’s actions were deliberate. One of these Marines said that Sergeant Peralta ‘reached over and pulled the grenade into himself.’ Another said he ‘hugged the grenade and saved the lives of the Marines in the room with him.’

“Given this uncontroverted testimony, which is consistent with the Navy Cross citation, I can not disagree more with DoD’s conclusion. DoD medical experts doubt that Sergeant Peralta had the physical capacity to cover the grenade with his body after being wounded, despite the fact that his squad members said they saw him do it with their own eyes.

“From the information provided by DoD, my understanding is that the neurosurgeon did not say that Sergeant Peralta’s actions were impossible but, rather, that the evidence did not meet the ‘no doubt standard necessary.’ Thus, the statements by those Marines who stood within a few feet of Sergeant Peralta should be given primacy.

“In matter of fact, many awards for valor in the history of our military have been given for actions which represented the last, fleeting moments of life that, even after medical examination, left experts wondering how someone could possibly do what they did. The answer has always been to trust their comrades in arms and eyewitness accounts. In Sergeant Peralta’s case, we should do no less.

“Clearly, Sergeant Peralta deserves the Medal of Honor. I hope the Secretary will immediately reconsider this decision.”

Both the article and the statement can be seen at:



http://nctimes.com/articles/2008/11/19/military/z642ecba607a103198825750700054c7c.txt

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#923973 --- 11/24/08 10:39 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Strawberry Jam]
Offline
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Registered: 01/09/06
Posts: 17154
Un freakin' believable.

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#923987 --- 11/24/08 10:52 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: ]
Senecamom Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 7411
Loc: On a journey......
Robert Gates- real upstanding guy.....

As deputy director and director of America's leading intelligence agency for many years, Gates and his CIA staff have been faulted for failing to accurately gauge the decline and disintegration of the Soviet Union. More particularly, Gates has been criticized for concocting evidence to show that the Soviet Union was stronger than it actually was, and also for repeatedly skewing intelligence to promote a particular worldview.[32] Also, according to Newsweek, Gates, as deputy director of CIA, allegedly vouched for the comprehensiveness of a CIA study presented to the Senate and President Reagan alleging that the Soviet Union played a role in the 1981 shooting of Pope John Paul II. A CIA internal review later denounced the report as being skewed, but that Gates did not try to influence the report's conclusions.


Level of involvement in the Iran-Contra scandal
Because of his senior status in the CIA, Gates was close to many figures who played significant roles in the Iran-Contra Affair and was in a position to have known of their activities. In 1984, as deputy director of CIA, Gates advocated that the U.S. initiate a bombing campaign against Nicaragua and that the U.S. do everything in its power short of direct military invasion of the country to remove the Sandinista government .

The evidence developed by Independent Counsel did not warrant indictment of Gates for his Iran-Contra activities or his responses to official inquiries.

Gates was an early subject of Independent Counsel's investigation, but the investigation of Gates intensified in the spring of 1991 as part of a larger inquiry into the Iran/contra activities of CIA officials.

This investigation received an additional impetus in May 1991, when President George H.W. Bush nominated Gates to be Director of Central Intelligence (DCI). The chairman and vice chairman of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence (SSCI) requested, in a letter to the Independent Counsel on May 15, 1991, any information that would “significantly bear on the fitness” of Gates for the CIA post.

Gates consistently testified that he first heard on October 1, 1986, from Charles E. Allen, the national intelligence officer who was closest to the Iran initiative, that proceeds from the Iran arms sales may have been diverted to support the Contras. Other evidence proves, however, that Gates received a report on the diversion during the summer of 1986 from DDI Richard Kerr.[

The issue was whether the Independent Counsel could prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Gates was deliberately not telling the truth when he later claimed not to have remembered any reference to the diversion before meeting with Allen in October.

Grand Jury secrecy rules hampered Independent Counsel's response. Nevertheless, in order to answer questions about Gates' prior testimony, Independent Counsel accelerated his investigation of Gates in the summer of 1991. This investigation was substantially completed by September 3, 1991, at which time Independent Counsel determined that Gates' Iran-Contra activities and testimony did not warrant prosecution.

Independent Counsel made this decision subject to developments that could have warranted reopening his inquiry, including testimony by Clair E. George, the CIA's former deputy director for operations. At the time Independent Counsel reached this decision, the possibility remained that George could have provided information warranting reconsideration of Gates's status in the investigation. George refused to cooperate with Independent Counsel and was indicted on September 19, 1991. George subpoenaed Gates to testify as a defense witness at George's first trial in the summer of 1994, but Gates was never called.
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#923994 --- 11/24/08 10:59 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Senecamom]
LaughinWillow Offline
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Registered: 04/12/01
Posts: 1950
Loc: State of Emergency
Why would this even be a big deal to the administration? What, do they have to give lifetime health insurance to the family of MOH recipients or something? I mean, why NOT just give the guy the medal?
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War with civilization begins...
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#923997 --- 11/24/08 11:01 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Senecamom]
Strawberry Jam Offline
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Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY

...In a letter to Hunter dated Tuesday, Secretary of Defense Robert Gates said that five independent experts reviewed the evidence and found it did not meet the required standard....

Required standard?

The guy died to save others....period.

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#923998 --- 11/24/08 11:01 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: LaughinWillow]
Senecamom Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 02/03/06
Posts: 7411
Loc: On a journey......
It's deplorable that they do not honor him.
_________________________
~Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I'll meet you there.~

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#924001 --- 11/24/08 11:05 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Senecamom]
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY
I found a site for a petition to give Peralta the medal, but found out that the petition had been closed by whomeever started it.

You can read the 3754 signatures here:

http://www.petitiononline.com/mod_perl/signed.cgi?rp2008&1

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#924003 --- 11/24/08 11:06 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Strawberry Jam]
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY

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#924006 --- 11/24/08 11:16 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Strawberry Jam]
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY
From the homepage for Marine:


"Tomorrow, at 1900 hours, we are going to declare war in the holy city of Fallujah. We are going to defeat the insurgents. Watch the news, it's going to be all over. Be proud of me, bro, I'm going to make history and do something that I always wanted to do.... If anything happens to me, just remember I lived my life to the fullest and I'm happy with what I lived."
-- Nov. 6, 2004 letter to brother, Ricardo, then 14



http://www.rafaelperalta.org/biography.htm

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#924095 --- 11/24/08 04:20 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Strawberry Jam]
Brightday Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/31/05
Posts: 1501
Very baffling. Hope they try again for the Medal of Honor for this soldier.

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#924110 --- 11/24/08 04:35 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Brightday]
Brightday Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/31/05
Posts: 1501
Criteria for Medal of Honor: It is bestowed on a member of the US Armed Forces who distinguishes himself "conspiciously by gallantry and intrepidity at the risk of his life above and beyond the call of duty while engaged in an action against an enemy of the US". (wikipedia.org)

Sounds like Sgt Peralta meets the criteria.

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#924111 --- 11/24/08 04:36 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Brightday]
Brightday Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/31/05
Posts: 1501
Criteria for Medal of Honor: It is bestowed on a member of the US Armed Forces who distinguishes himself "conspiciously by gallantry and intrepidity at the risk of his life above and beyond the call of duty while engaged in an action against an enemy of the US". (wikipedia.org)

Sounds like Sgt Peralta meets the criteria.

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#924117 --- 11/24/08 04:46 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Brightday]
reilley Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 11744
Loc: between here and there
I want those people to look at the mother in the eye and tell her why ... cause he can't do it , none of them can!
He is a Hero ..Secretary of Defense Robert Gates is a coward
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#924123 --- 11/24/08 04:50 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: reilley]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
Al Gore gets a Nobel prize for a sack of garbage and this guy gets a slap in the face for giving his life to save others. UNREAL!

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#924148 --- 11/24/08 05:47 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Night prowler]
Reinhart Faust Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/18/03
Posts: 6953
Loc: This Island Earth
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
Al Gore gets a Nobel prize for a sack of garbage and this guy gets a slap in the face for giving his life to save others. UNREAL!


What's unreal is how you can lament how unfairly we dastardly liberals have treated poor, misunderstood George Bush over the last eight years out of one side of your mouth, while using this family's tragedy and the subsequent injustice they've endured as an opportunity to take a cheap shot at Al Gore, who has nothing in the least to do with any of this, out of the other side of your mouth.
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Your proposition may be good, but let's have one thing understood, whatever it is; I'm against it.

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#924161 --- 11/24/08 06:17 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Reinhart Faust]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
Al Gore was given something that he did not deserve! This family deserves the highest honor for his actions that saved lives of others whether you like it or not.

Cheap shot towards Gore? I don't think so.

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#924168 --- 11/24/08 06:33 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Night prowler]
Reinhart Faust Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/18/03
Posts: 6953
Loc: This Island Earth
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
Al Gore was given something that he did not deserve!


Then take it up with the Nobel committee. Your axe to grind with Al Gore has nothing whatsoever to do with this family's tragedy, and you dishonor all of them when you exploit their pain to take a cheap shot (whether you choose to call it that or not) at Al Gore.

An awful lot of people who are or were in Washington in recent years got a lot of things they didn't deserve. You don't see me exploiting what happened to this soldier and his family as an excuse to grouse about it. Grow up.

Originally Posted By: Night prowler
This family deserves the highest honor for his actions that saved lives of others whether you like it or not.


Nice try, you pathetic punk. Only a delusional nut or an unscrupulous liar would take what I said as a suggestion that this soldier didn't deserve to be honored for his sacrifice. My guess is that you're both. That's why I can't be a conservative. There are some core values I agree with, but in practice conservatives like you bleat about morality and values while having none of your own.
_________________________
Your proposition may be good, but let's have one thing understood, whatever it is; I'm against it.

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#924176 --- 11/24/08 06:43 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Reinhart Faust]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
You live off mommy and daddy and you have the nerve to call me a punk? You need to go back to school, cause you wasted your parents hard earned money. You don't know anything.

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#924180 --- 11/24/08 06:49 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Night prowler]
Reinhart Faust Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/18/03
Posts: 6953
Loc: This Island Earth
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
You live off mommy and daddy and you have the nerve to call me a punk? You need to go back to school, cause you wasted your parents hard earned money. You don't know anything.


1) I have a job and live on my own and pay my own bills, thanks very much.

2) My parents helped me out some with college, but I also took out loans which have my name on them and which I pay every month, thanks very much again.

If you're looking to paint me as the conservatives' delusional stereotype of the liberal blogger living in his parents' basement or something of that sort, you're barking up the wrong tree. I earn my money and pay my own way, so find someplace else to stick your righteous indignation.
_________________________
Your proposition may be good, but let's have one thing understood, whatever it is; I'm against it.

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#924181 --- 11/24/08 06:49 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Night prowler]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
LOLOLOL

Now you're an expert on our family finances?

Cllllllllassic!
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http://blogs.fingerlakes1.com/snowcones/

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#924182 --- 11/24/08 06:50 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Reinhart Faust]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: Reinhart Faust
There are some core values I agree with, but in practice conservatives like you bleat about morality and values while having none of your own.


Bingo!

Plus, I LOOOOOOOOOOVE abortions! They are AWESOME! Another reason I could never be a conservative.
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http://blogs.fingerlakes1.com/snowcones/

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#924188 --- 11/24/08 06:59 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: past tense]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
I don't take kindly to personal attacks. I don't care who you are.

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#924189 --- 11/24/08 07:00 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Night prowler]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
LOL

Now that's just comedy, right there.
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http://blogs.fingerlakes1.com/snowcones/

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#924193 --- 11/24/08 07:04 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: past tense]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
you like that?

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#924194 --- 11/24/08 07:05 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Night prowler]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
You taking a stand against personal attacks?

Yeah, I love it. It's amazing!
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http://blogs.fingerlakes1.com/snowcones/

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#924195 --- 11/24/08 07:05 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Reinhart Faust]
Al Kida Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/14/06
Posts: 3102
Originally Posted By: Reinhart Faust
I earn my money and pay my own way



That is most selfish of you!!!

You should spread wealth and pay someone else way!!!
_________________________


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#924199 --- 11/24/08 07:07 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Al Kida]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
Yeah, spread it around. You're liberal right. Pay back your parents, then give some too kida. He's an illegal ya know.

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#924202 --- 11/24/08 07:09 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: past tense]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
Originally Posted By: past tense
Originally Posted By: Reinhart Faust
There are some core values I agree with, but in practice conservatives like you bleat about morality and values while having none of your own.


Bingo!

Plus, I LOOOOOOOOOOVE abortions! They are AWESOME! Another reason I could never be a conservative.


I think all liberals should have them.

Good reason for birth control too.


Edited by Night prowler (11/24/08 07:10 PM)

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#924204 --- 11/24/08 07:10 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
Funny, I said the same thing about the idiots (well, their parents I suppose) protesting in front of Planned Parenthood today.


Edited by past tense (11/24/08 07:10 PM)
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#924206 --- 11/24/08 07:12 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: past tense]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
LOL I hate protesters. This is America though, if that's what makes them happy.

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#924208 --- 11/24/08 07:12 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Night prowler]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
I don't take kindly to personal attacks. I don't care who you are.


And uh, yes you do. You only complain when they are directed at you or at a conservative poster. I never see you admonish, say, HarleyBob.

So you might not take kindly to personal attacks but you MOST CERTAINLY "care who they are".
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#924209 --- 11/24/08 07:12 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
RF, don't leave. Waiting for more.

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#924211 --- 11/24/08 07:14 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: past tense]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
Originally Posted By: past tense
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
I don't take kindly to personal attacks. I don't care who you are.


And uh, yes you do. You only complain when they are directed at you or at a conservative poster. I never see you admonish, say, HarleyBob.

So you might not take kindly to personal attacks but you MOST CERTAINLY "care who they are".
I take a stand against me only. Harleybob never attacked me

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#924212 --- 11/24/08 07:14 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: past tense]
Al Kida Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/14/06
Posts: 3102
Originally Posted By: past tense
You only complain when they are directed at you or a liberal poster.


Yes!!!

Mr. Night prowler hate liberal attacked!!!
_________________________


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#924213 --- 11/24/08 07:15 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
I would get mad if Harley attacked me, just as he would if I attacked him. Ask him

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#924215 --- 11/24/08 07:15 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
I take a stand against me only. Harleybob never attacked me


LOL

Nobility!
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http://blogs.fingerlakes1.com/snowcones/

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#924216 --- 11/24/08 07:16 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Al Kida]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: Al Kida
Originally Posted By: past tense
You only complain when they are directed at you or a liberal poster.


Yes!!!

Mr. Night prowler hate liberal attacked!!!


Chill, terrorist. I fixed it.
_________________________
http://blogs.fingerlakes1.com/snowcones/

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#924217 --- 11/24/08 07:16 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
I would get mad if Harley attacked me, just as he would if I attacked him. Ask him


Oh yeah, I'm on it. Next time he and I sit for tea and cookies. I'll add it to the list of things I think of each day to ask Harley, because I care deeply about his opinions and the inner workings of his mind.
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#924218 --- 11/24/08 07:17 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
Hey, guess what. We (Harleybob) may agree on some things, but I bet not everything. just as you and I may agree on things. funny how that works huh.

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#924221 --- 11/24/08 07:18 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
I like Al Kida, he's funny.

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#924222 --- 11/24/08 07:19 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
Hey, guess what. We (Harleybob) may agree on some things, but I bet not everything. just as you and I may agree on things. funny how that works huh.


Hey, you're saying that not all people agree on all things!?

Wow. So insightful. Thanks for the lesson in nuance.
_________________________
http://blogs.fingerlakes1.com/snowcones/

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#924223 --- 11/24/08 07:19 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
I bet all of us here agree this soldier this topic is about, most of us agree on, Right?


Edited by Night prowler (11/24/08 07:20 PM)

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#924227 --- 11/24/08 07:22 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
Off topic but, your in the dark almost all the time now. when will you see daylight again. Or do you get some now?

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#924230 --- 11/24/08 07:25 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
where are you pt?

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#924233 --- 11/24/08 07:28 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
wow, power outage?

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#924248 --- 11/24/08 07:44 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Bing Bong Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/12/08
Posts: 2482
Loc: the road to hell
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
I bet all of us here agree this soldier this topic is about, most of us agree on, Right?


Say WHAT??



I've learned that if I follow PT around she will usually lead me to some stunning examples of mental dwarfism.

I'm not disappointed this time.
_________________________
Charter Member of the VM Smith Memorial Park Committee

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#924249 --- 11/24/08 07:46 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Bing Bong Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/12/08
Posts: 2482
Loc: the road to hell
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
wow, power outage?


That might be one way of describing your problem.

"Two cans short of a six-pack" might do it, too.
_________________________
Charter Member of the VM Smith Memorial Park Committee

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#924260 --- 11/24/08 08:04 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Bing Bong]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
lol, something like that.
I don't know why I bother....

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#924262 --- 11/24/08 08:05 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Reinhart Faust Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/18/03
Posts: 6953
Loc: This Island Earth
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
I bet all of us here agree this soldier this topic is about, most of us agree on, Right?


Absolutely not. This thread is about how Al Gore didn't deserve his Nobe Prize.
_________________________
Your proposition may be good, but let's have one thing understood, whatever it is; I'm against it.

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#924263 --- 11/24/08 08:07 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Reinhart Faust]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
Why do you care how I feel about Gore?

I guess that means you don't think this soldier deserves the medal of honor?


Edited by Night prowler (11/24/08 08:09 PM)

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#924273 --- 11/24/08 08:35 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Reinhart Faust]
HarleyBobT Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/22/08
Posts: 5106
Loc: Walloon Freedom Fighter
Originally Posted By: Reinhart Faust
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
Al Gore gets a Nobel prize for a sack of garbage and this guy gets a slap in the face for giving his life to save others. UNREAL!


What's unreal is how you can lament how unfairly we dastardly liberals have treated poor, misunderstood George Bush over the last eight years out of one side of your mouth, while using this family's tragedy and the subsequent injustice they've endured as an opportunity to take a cheap shot at Al Gore, who has nothing in the least to do with any of this, out of the other side of your mouth.

Gore's a phony just like you RF. He flaps his gum's about global warming, big Al found a money making niche.
_________________________
Kristin Davis for NY State Governor,a hard working girl and the hottest candidate NY has ever seen.

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#924310 --- 11/24/08 10:04 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Reinhart Faust Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/18/03
Posts: 6953
Loc: This Island Earth
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
Why do you care how I feel about Gore?


Why did you think this thread was an appropriate place to whine about Gore? You're the one who brought it up. Does his Nobel have any bearing on this soldier or his family?

Originally Posted By: Night prowler
I guess that means you don't think this soldier deserves the medal of honor?


I guess you're just a giant tool who likes to exploit the legitimate tragedies of fallen servicemen in pursuing your petty grievances.
_________________________
Your proposition may be good, but let's have one thing understood, whatever it is; I'm against it.

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#924313 --- 11/24/08 10:31 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Reinhart Faust]
Brightday Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/31/05
Posts: 1501
May Sgt Peralta rest in peace.

I would guess NP that you are directing your political anger in the wrong direction. The post was started by someone attempting to bring exposure to a seemingly unjust situation because of a denial of a Medal of Honor to a US soldier killed in action while saving the lives of his fellow soldiers.

RF is as indignant about this as the majority of us are.

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#924393 --- 11/25/08 05:27 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Brightday]
Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 01/09/06
Posts: 17154
Could Bush, as Commander-in-Chief, ORDER the Medal be awarded?

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#924413 --- 11/25/08 05:57 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: ]
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY
Originally Posted By: Festus!
Could Bush, as Commander-in-Chief, ORDER the Medal be awarded?


I don't know, but it seems as though he should be able to.

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#924458 --- 11/25/08 07:40 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Strawberry Jam]
Jeff Peters Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/03/07
Posts: 1005
Loc: Geneva
Do you really want a politician deciding who gets the MOH and who does not get it?

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#924462 --- 11/25/08 07:57 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Reinhart Faust]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
Originally Posted By: Reinhart Faust
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
Why do you care how I feel about Gore?


Why did you think this thread was an appropriate place to whine about Gore? You're the one who brought it up. Does his Nobel have any bearing on this soldier or his family?

Originally Posted By: Night prowler
I guess that means you don't think this soldier deserves the medal of honor?


I guess you're just a giant tool who likes to exploit the legitimate tragedies of fallen servicemen in pursuing your petty grievances.


I made the comparison because it makes no sense, not to be attacked by some snot nosed punk. This young man gave his life to save others, yet he is UNWORTHY of the medal of honor? That's crap and everyone knows it! Yet Gore gets a Nobel prize for lies! Yes Two different subjects, but one gets something he did not deserve and the other Has to die to not even get the honor he deserves. It's not my problem you took issue with it, it is mine that you attacked me.

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#924465 --- 11/25/08 08:02 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Night prowler]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
You live off mommy and daddy and you have the nerve to call me a punk? You need to go back to school, cause you wasted your parents hard earned money. You don't know anything.


RF and PT are brilliant compared to you. I applaud their parents for raising two such fine offspring.
_________________________
http://www.nocayugalandintotrust.net

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#924467 --- 11/25/08 08:04 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: trump]
Night prowler Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 690
Loc: ny
wait till you wake up.

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#924468 --- 11/25/08 08:06 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Jeff Peters]
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY
Originally Posted By: Jeff Peters
Do you really want a politician deciding who gets the MOH and who does not get it?


No. But the POTUS is also the commander in chief. Someone needs to clarify why this young man was denied the honor he so richly deserves. His own squad witnessed his covering the grenade in order to save others. That should be accounted for.

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#924471 --- 11/25/08 08:10 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Night prowler]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
wait till you wake up.


The nation has woke up and elected for president the man that RF and PT suported.
_________________________
http://www.nocayugalandintotrust.net

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#924473 --- 11/25/08 08:14 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Strawberry Jam]
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY

The Medal of Honor, established by joint resolution of Congress, 12 July 1862 (amended by Act of 9 July 1918 and Act of 25 July 1963) is awarded in the name of Congress to a person who, while a member of the Armed Services, distinguishes himself conspicuously by gallantry and intrepidity at the risk of his life above and beyond the call of duty while engaged in an action against any enemy of The United States; while engaged in military operations involving conflict with an opposing foreign force; or while serving with friendly foreign forces engaged in an armed conflict against an opposing armed force in which The United States is not a belligerent party. The deed performed must have been one of personal bravery or self-sacrifice so conspicuous as to clearly distinguish the individual above his comrades and must have involved risk of life. Incontestable proof of the performance of service is exacted and each recommendation for award of this decoration is considered on the standard of extraordinary merit. Full-text Listings of Medal of Honor Citations The President, in the name of Congress, has awarded more than 3,400 Medals of Honor to our nation's bravest Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen, Marines, and Coast Guardsmen since the decoration's creation in 1861.

http://www.medalofhonor.com/


Here is the process:

The following organizations and individuals play key roles in the Army Medal of Honor recommendation process:

* CHAIN OF COMMAND
Submits award recommendation that meets the two year submission time limit to Department of the Army Personnel Command
* MEMBER OF CONGRESS
Submits award recommendation that is outside the two year limit for submission to Department of the Army Personnel Command or the Secretary of the Army who forwards request to Personnel Command.
* DEPARTMENT OF THE ARMY PERSONNEL COMMAND
Army Decoration Board - Merit Review, can disprove based on criteria (Cdr, HRC can overrule)
Senior Army Decorations Board - Recommends approval, disapproval, or downgrade.
* MANPOWER AND RESERVE AFFAIRS
Concurs or nonconcurs with Board recommendation
* CHIEF OF STAFF OF THE ARMY
Concurs or nonconcurs with Board recommendation
* SECRETARY OF THE ARMY
Recommends approval or can disapprove. Also forwards packet to Chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff for comment.
* SECRETARY OF DEFENSE
Recommends approval or can disapprove.
* PRESIDENT
Approves or disapproves.

http://www.medalofhonor.com/RecommendationProcess.htm

Sounds to me like Peralta meets the criteria, and Bush could award him the MOH posthumously.

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#924474 --- 11/25/08 08:15 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: trump]
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
wait till you wake up.


The nation has woke up and elected for president the man that RF and PT suported.


Is there really a need, by anyone, to make this thread a partisan issue? Really?

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#924475 --- 11/25/08 08:20 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Night prowler]
Reinhart Faust Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/18/03
Posts: 6953
Loc: This Island Earth
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
Originally Posted By: Reinhart Faust
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
Why do you care how I feel about Gore?


Why did you think this thread was an appropriate place to whine about Gore? You're the one who brought it up. Does his Nobel have any bearing on this soldier or his family?

Originally Posted By: Night prowler
I guess that means you don't think this soldier deserves the medal of honor?


I guess you're just a giant tool who likes to exploit the legitimate tragedies of fallen servicemen in pursuing your petty grievances.


I made the comparison because it makes no sense, not to be attacked by some snot nosed punk. This young man gave his life to save others, yet he is UNWORTHY of the medal of honor? That's crap and everyone knows it! Yet Gore gets a Nobel prize for lies! Yes Two different subjects, but one gets something he did not deserve and the other Has to die to not even get the honor he deserves. It's not my problem you took issue with it, it is mine that you attacked me.


If it sticks in your craw that bad, then start another thread for it. This is not the place for your petty political axe grinding.
_________________________
Your proposition may be good, but let's have one thing understood, whatever it is; I'm against it.

Top
#924477 --- 11/25/08 08:24 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Strawberry Jam]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Strawberry Jam
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
wait till you wake up.


The nation has woke up and elected for president the man that RF and PT suported.


Is there really a need, by anyone, to make this thread a partisan issue? Really?


No there isn't. Night Prowler should of never started it.
_________________________
http://www.nocayugalandintotrust.net

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#924512 --- 11/25/08 09:36 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: trump]
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: Strawberry Jam
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
wait till you wake up.


The nation has woke up and elected for president the man that RF and PT suported.


Is there really a need, by anyone, to make this thread a partisan issue? Really?


No there isn't. Night Prowler should of never started it.


And others could have let it go as well.

Back on topic, I think it is a shame that his family has to fight for something that Peralta is clearly entitled to.

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#924529 --- 11/25/08 10:02 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Strawberry Jam]
trump Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/15/08
Posts: 887
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Strawberry Jam
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: Strawberry Jam
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
wait till you wake up.


The nation has woke up and elected for president the man that RF and PT suported.


Is there really a need, by anyone, to make this thread a partisan issue? Really?


No there isn't. Night Prowler should of never started it.


And others could have let it go as well.

Back on topic, I think it is a shame that his family has to fight for something that Peralta is clearly entitled to.


I agree with you on Peralta.
_________________________
http://www.nocayugalandintotrust.net

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#924553 --- 11/25/08 10:25 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Strawberry Jam]
Ms Cracktholomew Offline
Member

Registered: 10/29/08
Posts: 105
Loc: emailing FL1
Originally Posted By: Strawberry Jam
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: Strawberry Jam
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
wait till you wake up.


The nation has woke up and elected for president the man that RF and PT suported.


Is there really a need, by anyone, to make this thread a partisan issue? Really?


No there isn't. Night Prowler should of never started it.


And others could have let it go as well.

Back on topic, I think it is a shame that his family has to fight for something that Peralta is clearly entitled to.



It's a shame this young man is being denied the honor he deserves.

It's also a shame that those two idiots, HarleyBT and Nightprowler had to ruin the thread with their mindless ramblings.
_________________________
I used to buy the paper - had considered getting it again. But now, I do not think so.

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#924561 --- 11/25/08 10:35 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Bing Bong]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: Bing Bong
I've learned that if I follow PT around she will usually lead me to some stunning examples of mental dwarfism.

I'm not disappointed this time.


I can't tell you how that devastates me.

We have about 5.5 hours of sunlight at the moment, losing about 7 minutes per day.

I didn't have a power outage, just better things to do.
_________________________
http://blogs.fingerlakes1.com/snowcones/

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#924562 --- 11/25/08 10:38 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: trump]
past tense Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 03/05/03
Posts: 29711
Loc: Houston, TX
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
wait till you wake up.


The nation has woke up and elected for president the man that RF and PT suported.


Don't get your boner working.

I voted for Obama, I didn't actively campaign for him or anything. And I got on board late - well after Palin joined the McCain ticket.

And trust me, my parents don't care what YOU think of their parenting either.
_________________________
http://blogs.fingerlakes1.com/snowcones/

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#924571 --- 11/25/08 10:55 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: past tense]
NYTwinsFan Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/27/08
Posts: 1405
Loc: Valiente Corazones Fantasma
~


Edited by NYTwinsFan (11/25/08 11:11 AM)
_________________________
NYPGR - Region 2
SAL - Squadron -366
AMF- Illegitimi non carborundum

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#924581 --- 11/25/08 11:06 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: ]
Bing Bong Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/12/08
Posts: 2482
Loc: the road to hell
Originally Posted By: Festus!
Could Bush, as Commander-in-Chief, ORDER the Medal be awarded?


I think Congress has to do that.
_________________________
Charter Member of the VM Smith Memorial Park Committee

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#924583 --- 11/25/08 11:09 AM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Gr [Re: Strawberry Jam]
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY
Originally Posted By: Strawberry Jam

The Medal of Honor, established by joint resolution of Congress, 12 July 1862 (amended by Act of 9 July 1918 and Act of 25 July 1963) is awarded in the name of Congress to a person who, while a member of the Armed Services, distinguishes himself conspicuously by gallantry and intrepidity at the risk of his life above and beyond the call of duty while engaged in an action against any enemy of The United States; while engaged in military operations involving conflict with an opposing foreign force; or while serving with friendly foreign forces engaged in an armed conflict against an opposing armed force in which The United States is not a belligerent party. The deed performed must have been one of personal bravery or self-sacrifice so conspicuous as to clearly distinguish the individual above his comrades and must have involved risk of life. Incontestable proof of the performance of service is exacted and each recommendation for award of this decoration is considered on the standard of extraordinary merit. Full-text Listings of Medal of Honor Citations The President, in the name of Congress, has awarded more than 3,400 Medals of Honor to our nation's bravest Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen, Marines, and Coast Guardsmen since the decoration's creation in 1861.

http://www.medalofhonor.com/


Here is the process:

The following organizations and individuals play key roles in the Army Medal of Honor recommendation process:

* CHAIN OF COMMAND
Submits award recommendation that meets the two year submission time limit to Department of the Army Personnel Command
* MEMBER OF CONGRESS
Submits award recommendation that is outside the two year limit for submission to Department of the Army Personnel Command or the Secretary of the Army who forwards request to Personnel Command.
* DEPARTMENT OF THE ARMY PERSONNEL COMMAND
Army Decoration Board - Merit Review, can disprove based on criteria (Cdr, HRC can overrule)
Senior Army Decorations Board - Recommends approval, disapproval, or downgrade.
* MANPOWER AND RESERVE AFFAIRS
Concurs or nonconcurs with Board recommendation
* CHIEF OF STAFF OF THE ARMY
Concurs or nonconcurs with Board recommendation
* SECRETARY OF THE ARMY
Recommends approval or can disapprove. Also forwards packet to Chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff for comment.
* SECRETARY OF DEFENSE
Recommends approval or can disapprove.
* PRESIDENT
Approves or disapproves.


http://www.medalofhonor.com/RecommendationProcess.htm

Sounds to me like Peralta meets the criteria, and Bush could award him the MOH posthumously.

Top
#924827 --- 11/25/08 02:47 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Strawberry Jam]
Cleopatra Offline
Member

Registered: 11/12/08
Posts: 57
Loc: Egypt
Originally Posted By: Strawberry Jam
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: Strawberry Jam
Originally Posted By: trump
Originally Posted By: Night prowler
wait till you wake up.


The nation has woke up and elected for president the man that RF and PT suported.


Is there really a need, by anyone, to make this thread a partisan issue? Really?


No there isn't. Night Prowler should of never started it.


And others could have let it go as well.

Back on topic, I think it is a shame that his family has to fight for something that Peralta is clearly entitled to.


This is a shame! Thanks for the posting.
_________________________
“Be it known that we, the greatest, are misthought.”
Cleopatra quote


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#926169 --- 11/26/08 09:14 PM Re: Marine Denied Medal of Honor after Covering Grenad [Re: Cleopatra]
SkySoldier Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 08/18/01
Posts: 25300
Loc: Finger Lakes National Forest, ...
A young man, a grenadier with the 173d Airborne Infantry named Barnes, smothered the blast of a hand grendade with his body in Dak To during the "Battle of the Slopes" in 1967.

A Col first refused to consider him for ANY medal let alone the CMH.

The COl's words in denying submitting Barnes for the Medal of Honor were ...

And I quote ...

"We don't give medals for suicide."

The uproar among the troops of the Sky Soldiers, caused by that comment, cannot be understated.


Barnes was awarded the Medal Of Honor after that unit stood up to a man and officer rock solid behind Barnes.

http://www.mishalov.com/Barnes.html

The Medal was, of course, awarded posthumously.
_________________________
America has problems.

We can fix that.

America is not THE problem.

Next time. Vote for the AMERICAN.


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