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#171835 --- 05/23/05 04:14 PM Re: Going to Pieces
Ovidian Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 12/02/02
Posts: 11435
Loc: gone
Dick, your white. It is not okay for you to defend your self! SIT THERE AND TAKE WHAT EVER COMES YOUR WAY!!!!!!!

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#171836 --- 05/23/05 10:29 PM Re: Going to Pieces
Okla.ndn Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/21/02
Posts: 3074
Loc: Osage Indian Nation in Oklahom...
Quote:

Quote:

I thought more of you before the statement about "getting richer".




Exactly my point, SBJ.
A question for Okla. What are you (the tribe as a whole) going to do if you do win this land back? Do you intend to come back to NYS and live on it?
No rhetoric, please. Just a simple answer to a simple question.


I don't speak for the (Tribe as a whole).
_________________________
I am a General Council member of the Seneca-Cayuga Tribe I speak for my self not my Tribe.

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#171837 --- 05/23/05 11:32 PM Re: Going to Pieces
EYRIE Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 3279
Loc: Wherever Life leads me
Still refusing to give a direct answer, Okla? Then speak for yourself. Speak for others in the tribe that you know. Do you intend to move to this land if the court finds in your favor? Yes or no?
_________________________
He who gossips to u may also gossip about u.

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#171838 --- 05/24/05 05:53 AM Re: Going to Pieces
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Quote:


A question for Okla. What are you (the tribe as a whole) going to do if you do win this land back? Do you intend to come back to NYS and live on it?
No rhetoric, please. Just a simple answer to a simple question.




Could it be that the only correct answer would be that his tribe ONLY wants a casino and he doesn't want to say that.

His tribe has a casino in Oklahoma.

They do not want the land, they do not want the 10, 30, 247... million dollars because a casino can bring in that kind of money in a short time. Over the long haul, a casino would bring more money (profits) than the return of the land or any court award. This is the reason that the tribes will look for any loophole to gain a casino. In addition, NY state has very little competition as it relates to casinos (illegal).
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"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#171839 --- 05/24/05 06:44 AM Re: Going to Pieces
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Quote:

.
A question for Okla. What are you (the tribe as a whole) going to do if you do win this land back? Do you intend to come back to NYS and live on it?
No rhetoric, please. Just a simple answer to a simple question.





The state with the most tribal casinos--82--is Oklahoma, where tribes rake in as much as $2.2 billion a year--and the state doesn't get a cent. Oklahoma Indians, who comprise 7 percent of the state population, have become the most powerful political force there. Meanwhile, officials estimate that Oklahoma's 39 tribes cost the state over $700 million a year--in lost property taxes, lost revenues on tax-free cigarettes, and lost excise taxes and tag fees from cars sold by reservation dealerships. That's nearly the equivalent of the state's 2003 budgetary shortfall, enough to pay for 18,000 teachers.
_________________________
"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#171840 --- 05/24/05 07:33 PM Re: Going to Pieces
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Quote:


The state with the most tribal casinos--82--is Oklahoma, where tribes rake in as much as $2.2 billion a year--and the state doesn't get a cent. Oklahoma Indians, who comprise 7 percent of the state population, have become the most powerful political force there. Meanwhile, officials estimate that Oklahoma's 39 tribes cost the state over $700 million a year--in lost property taxes, lost revenues on tax-free cigarettes, and lost excise taxes and tag fees from cars sold by reservation dealerships. That's nearly the equivalent of the state's 2003 budgetary shortfall, enough to pay for 18,000 teachers.




Okla - I have read you repeatedly indicate on this forum that you pay all your taxes just like you would in NY state but this newspaper article states otherwise. If the state of Oklahoma is not impressed by the tribes and their casinos why would NY state want to open the door to your tribe and a 'pandoras box'?
_________________________
"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#171841 --- 05/24/05 11:41 PM Re: Going to Pieces
Okla.ndn Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/21/02
Posts: 3074
Loc: Osage Indian Nation in Oklahom...
Quote:

Quote:


The state with the most tribal casinos--82--is Oklahoma, where tribes rake in as much as $2.2 billion a year--and the state doesn't get a cent. Oklahoma Indians, who comprise 7 percent of the state population, have become the most powerful political force there. Meanwhile, officials estimate that Oklahoma's 39 tribes cost the state over $700 million a year--in lost property taxes, lost revenues on tax-free cigarettes, and lost excise taxes and tag fees from cars sold by reservation dealerships. That's nearly the equivalent of the state's 2003 budgetary shortfall, enough to pay for 18,000 teachers.


Oklahoma was never to be a state but like all the promises that were made were broke. But you think we should accept the illegal dealings done by New York. Oh by the way Oklahoma is going to get their cut from gaming.And we pay a state and fed. tax on our smokes, our land has never been taxed. We didn't have to share class II gaming money. But we do give a lot, but that news doesn't sale many news papers. The Tribes are the 2nd largest employer in the state. Tribal employes pay the same tax that any other employes in the state pay. Most of the employes don't live on Indian land so they pay the same as everyone does.

Okla - I have read you repeatedly indicate on this forum that you pay all your taxes just like you would in NY state but this newspaper article states otherwise. If the state of Oklahoma is not impressed by the tribes and their casinos why would NY state want to open the door to your tribe and a 'pandoras box'?


Thats an old article. LOL Watch and see how well Oklahoma makes out with the new gaming pacts made with the Tribes.
_________________________
I am a General Council member of the Seneca-Cayuga Tribe I speak for my self not my Tribe.

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#171842 --- 05/24/05 11:56 PM Re: Going to Pieces
Okla.ndn Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/21/02
Posts: 3074
Loc: Osage Indian Nation in Oklahom...
Quote:

Still refusing to give a direct answer, Okla? Then speak for yourself. Speak for others in the tribe that you know. Do you intend to move to this land if the court finds in your favor? Yes or no?


No I do not intend to move. I do intend to build a place there and spend part of the year there, win or lose. The issue has not been talked about much so I can't say about other members.
_________________________
I am a General Council member of the Seneca-Cayuga Tribe I speak for my self not my Tribe.

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#171843 --- 05/25/05 06:26 PM Re: Going to Pieces
EYRIE Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 3279
Loc: Wherever Life leads me
Quote:

Quote:

Still refusing to give a direct answer, Okla? Then speak for yourself. Speak for others in the tribe that you know. Do you intend to move to this land if the court finds in your favor? Yes or no?


No I do not intend to move. I do intend to build a place there and spend part of the year there, win or lose. The issue has not been talked about much so I can't say about other members.





Thank you for an honest, direct answer.
_________________________
He who gossips to u may also gossip about u.

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#171844 --- 05/26/05 05:58 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Old Broad Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/12/02
Posts: 710
Loc: Whitewater, Ca. USA
Quote:

We are getting stronger and richer by the day. LOL

--------------------
I am a General Council member of the Seneca-Cayuga Tribe I speak for my self not my Tribe




If my memory serves me right and from what I have read , your ForeFathers signed a contract and was paid at least twice for the land that you are now saying still belongs to you and that we ran your people off.. It's been said that a certain Chief was not at the meeting where the contract was signed and money was exchanged.. That's why you feel that the land still belongs to you. Were you there and know that for a fact or are you just blowing smoke at us trying to make us believe it's coming from a peace pipe..
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I try to take one day at a time, but sometimes several days attack me all at once.

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#171845 --- 05/26/05 06:10 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Old Broad Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/12/02
Posts: 710
Loc: Whitewater, Ca. USA
From what I have just read, Mr Halbritter and his Henchmen are no better that Organized crime..
_________________________
I try to take one day at a time, but sometimes several days attack me all at once.

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#171846 --- 05/26/05 08:54 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Okla.ndn Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/21/02
Posts: 3074
Loc: Osage Indian Nation in Oklahom...
Quote:

Quote:

We are getting stronger and richer by the day. LOL

--------------------
I am a General Council member of the Seneca-Cayuga Tribe I speak for my self not my Tribe




If my memory serves me right and from what I have read , your ForeFathers signed a contract and was paid at least twice for the land that you are now saying still belongs to you and that we ran your people off.. It's been said that a certain Chief was not at the meeting where the contract was signed and money was exchanged.. That's why you feel that the land still belongs to you. Were you there and know that for a fact or are you just blowing smoke at us trying to make us believe it's coming from a peace pipe..


It was your Chief that was not represented at the meeting when the illegal deal was made. Now put that in your peace pipe old one.
_________________________
I am a General Council member of the Seneca-Cayuga Tribe I speak for my self not my Tribe.

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#171847 --- 05/26/05 02:53 PM Re: Going to Pieces
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Quote:

From what I have just read, Mr Halbritter and his Henchmen are no better that Organized crime..




Here is a difference, Ray doesn't have to worry about the feds coming after him for his illegal casino operations.
_________________________
"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#171848 --- 05/26/05 04:48 PM Re: Going to Pieces
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Quote:

From what I have just read, Mr Halbritter and his Henchmen are no better that Organized crime..




Speaking of Organized Crime and Casinos...........



A jury Tuesday awarded more than $242 million to a group of investors in a failed plan to develop an Indian casino in Kenosha.

Dealing With The Casinos


The defendants were three partners in Nii-Jii Entertainment, a firm created to develop the Paradise Key casino for the Menominee Indian Nation at the site of the Dairyland Greyhound Park racetrack. The Paradise Key casino management firm also was a defendant.

The jury found defendants Morgan Murphy Jr., Morgan Murphy III and Robert D. Boyle had failed to disclose Murphy Jr.'s past business links to two Chicago crime figures.

In addition, the jury found that the main developers of the casino - the Murphys and Boyle - had committed securities fraud, mail fraud, theft, embezzlement and racketeering in connection with their concealment of the links to John Serpico and John Credidio, described in the civil complaint in the case as "two persons of notorious and unsavory reputation" for their involvement in an unrelated kickback scheme.

Murphy Jr. has said he was unaware of kickbacks a Chicago bank has admitted it paid Serpico, who was a partner with Murphy Jr. in a real estate deal. Serpico and Credido were convicted of fraud in connection with the deal.

The findings were for purposes of the civil case, heard before Racine County Circuit Judge Gerald Ptacek. Murphy Jr., his son and Boyle have not been charged criminally in connection with the Nii-Jii deal.

The ties to crime figures meant likely failure of the casino deal because of the insistence by gambling regulators on squeaky clean backgrounds of casino officials. The Nii-Jii plan was withdrawn by the Menominee tribe in 2001 while it was under federal review.

The plaintiffs, Nii-Jii investors Dick Platt, Al Cohl and others, were awarded $21.5 million and Nii-Jii was awarded $220.9 million, according to plaintiffs' attorney George Kersten. The Murphys, Boyle and their law firm, as well as the Paradise Key management firm, were held liable for the damages, Kersten said.

He called the jury award "a major step forward" but acknowledged litigation was likely far from over.
_________________________
"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#171849 --- 05/29/05 04:39 PM Re: Going to Pieces
EYRIE Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 3279
Loc: Wherever Life leads me
Now put that in your peace pipe old one.


Well, another myth down the drain. I always thought Native Americans were know for their respect for their elders. Or is that only respect for Native American elders?
_________________________
He who gossips to u may also gossip about u.

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#171850 --- 05/29/05 10:46 PM Re: Going to Pieces
Okla.ndn Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/21/02
Posts: 3074
Loc: Osage Indian Nation in Oklahom...
Quote:

Now put that in your peace pipe old one.


Well, another myth down the drain. I always thought Native Americans were know for their respect for their elders. Or is that only respect for Native American elders?


How do you know who the elder is? The respect is for all elders but the ones that talk bs.
_________________________
I am a General Council member of the Seneca-Cayuga Tribe I speak for my self not my Tribe.

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#171851 --- 06/01/05 08:02 PM Re: Going to Pieces
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Airport area casino put on hold by ruling
By MATT GRYTA
News Staff Reporter
5/26/2005

A judge Wednesday barred construction of a casino in Cheektowaga until the state performs an environmental impact study, which could take two years. State Supreme Court Justice Joseph G. Makowski issued a permanent injunction halting work on the proposed casino pending completion of the study.

In a 51-page decision, Makowski blocked Uniland Development from selling the 57-acre Airborne Business Park, east of Buffalo Niagara International Airport, to the Seneca Nation until the state completes mandated environmental studies.

Timothy Sherry, president of the 5,000-member Concern Inc., a citizens group seeking the court order for more than a year, called Makowski's ruling "the right thing to do." The organization is concerned about potential impact on nearby residential areas.

"This has always been about getting the state and the township to comply with environmental laws," said Sherry.

Michael B. Powers and Adam Walters, attorneys for Concern Inc., said they believe Makowski's ruling effectively kills the Cheektowaga casino.

Last June, Makowski, in a decision still being appealed by the Town of Cheektowaga, faulted Gov. George E. Pataki for violating the 2002 casino compact by slighting Buffalo in favor of Cheektowaga.

Powers and Walters pointed out that recently the Seneca Nation seems to have decided against a Cheektowaga venture, focusing instead on a Buffalo site.

Powers and Walters believe the Senecas, who face a Dec. 9 ground-breaking deadline on an Erie County casino, are unlikely to keep fighting for the Cheektowaga site.

The Appellate Division of State Supreme Court in Rochester expected to hear arguments in October on the appeal of Makowski's decision of last June.

Under that ruling, the judge stopped the state from releasing funding for the Cheektowaga casino project.


Buffalo News
_________________________
"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#171852 --- 06/02/05 01:05 AM Re: Going to Pieces
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Finger Lakes News Network

Halftown Wants Cayuga Law Firm Fired

Cayuga Indian Nation representative Clint Halftown says he backed out of a proposed settlement of the Cayuga land claim because of what he says was a fiscal relationship that had developed between the Cayugas' law firm and Empire Resorts. Empire stood to profit from building a Cayuga casino in the Catskills as part of the settlement agreement. Halftown is calling for the removal of the Manhattan law firm. Halftown is embroiled in a dispute over who has the right to speak and enter into agreements for the Nation. Area lawmakers say the US Supreme Court's decision in the Sherrill case effectively takes any land claim settlement deals off the table.
_________________________
"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#171853 --- 06/02/05 07:01 AM Re: Going to Pieces
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Kingston Mayor James Sottile on Wednesday joined the growing list of opponents to an Indian tribe's proposed casino in Saugerties.

Sottile said a gaming hall in the northern Ulster County town would ruin the "quaint" character of the community and "overshadow" its historical significance.

The Democratic mayor said he also would oppose construction of a casino in the Kingston area but not necessarily in the southwestern part of the county, such as the Ellenville area, where resorts are part of the landscape.

"I just don't think that a casino should be plopped into a town or a city," the mayor said, referring to a proposal by the Seneca-Cayugas Tribe of Oklahoma to build a casino, hotel, entertainment center and golf course on the Winston Farm in Saugerties. "I think if we are going to look at a casino, we should look at the resorts rather than taking them and plopping them right in a middle of a community."

The majority leader of the Kingston Common Council, Bill Reynolds, said he objects to a casino being built anywhere in Ulster County and will ask the council to approve a resolution endorsing that opposition.

"It's just bad news," said Reynolds, D-Ward 7. "It may bring more money, but what would that money pay for? We would have to pay for more police officers, and we may need more social workers, addiction counselors."

No date has been set for a vote on Reynolds' resolution. The town boards in Woodstock, New Paltz and Shandaken already have approved resolutions opposing casinos in Ulster County.

A group of Ulster County legislators from Saugerties has proposed a resolution that would let officials in any given town decide the fate of a casino proposed for their community. The resolution does not take a position the Winston Farm plan but would bar the county from negotiating with any tribal government for casino development without the host municipality first giving its approval, either by a vote of the municipal board or a public referendum.

The Saugerties Town Board is to vote next Wednesday on a resolution that objects to the Winston Farm proposal. Town Supervisor Greg Helsmoortel and village of Saugerties Mayor Robert Yerick already have voiced opposition to the Seneca-Cayuga plan.

Additionally, Saugerties-based opponents of the casino have formed a group called No Saugerties Casino Inc. A public forum hosted by the group drew about 250 people to the John D. Greco Senior Center in Saugerties on Tuesday.

Sottile said the negative impacts of a casino in Saugerties probably would be felt in Kingston.

"There may be some sales tax (revenue), but that tax would probably go to pay for the problems that casinos create," Sottile said. "I just don't think Winston Farm is a good site for a casino.

Town of Ulster Supervisor Fred Wadnola and Deputy Supervisor Barbara Wise, both Republicans, don't expect their Town Board to take up an anti-casino resolution anytime soon.

Wise offered no personal opinion on the Saugerties plan, but said: "I think that any industry, whether it be a casino or a factory, if they are opposed by the host community, they are going to have a uphill battle."
_________________________
"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#171854 --- 06/28/05 05:24 PM Re: Going to Pieces
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Finger Lakes News Network


Court says Cayuga Nation not entitled to land claim

In a stunning reversal, a federal appeals court ruled Tuesday the Cayuga Indians aren't entitled to a 248 million dollar land claim judgment awarded them by a lower court.



The Second U-S Circuit Court of Appeals cited the U-S Supreme Court's recent ruling in the tax case involving the Oneida Indians and the city of Sherrill. The high court said too many years had passed for the Oneidas to claim that their reacquired former reservation lands were again sovereign and tax-exempt. The appeals court reversed and dismissed the Cayuga's entire 25-year-old land claim. Attorney William Dorr, who represented Cayuga and Seneca counties, called it a complete victory. Governor Pataki called it ``a tremendous victory for the property owners and taxpayers of Central New York.'' Attorney Glenn Feldman, who represented the Indians, said the ruling could be the death knell for all Indian land claims based on historic taking of land. The Oneidas, Onondagas, Mohawks and Senecas also have land claims pending against New York.
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"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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