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#171815 --- 05/21/05 05:38 PM Re: Going to Pieces
Devious Offline
Member

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 130
Loc: Seneca Falls New York
Quote:

Thank you for clarifying your real stance: money money money....not really about getting the tribal land back, but using the tribal land to make an almighty buck. Such warm tradition in your words. I am sure your forefathers are proud of you.




I see our GREAT WHITE FATHERS are not the only ones with deep pockets..
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#171816 --- 05/21/05 11:15 PM Re: Going to Pieces
EYRIE Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 3279
Loc: Wherever Life leads me
So much for the Noble Red Man.
It's all about the money.
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He who gossips to u may also gossip about u.

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#171817 --- 05/22/05 12:50 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Della Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 12/22/04
Posts: 16305
Loc: Seneca Falls
are any of you Indian?
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What a shame to have to beg you to see we're not all the same

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#171818 --- 05/22/05 07:32 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Ovidian Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 12/02/02
Posts: 11435
Loc: gone
Probably many here have some Indian heritage. Oddly enough when I see Indians on the news they look like white guys with pony tails.

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#171819 --- 05/22/05 10:12 AM Re: Going to Pieces
EYRIE Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 3279
Loc: Wherever Life leads me
Sorry, Della. That remark was not intended as a general remark, but rather as a statement of my disappointment in one particular native American and his "noble cause".
No, unlike a lot of people who claim native american ancestry, I have no native American blood, nor did any of my ancestors come over on the Mayflower.
I am of northern and central European stock. Immigrants who came to this great country to escape their own form of persecution. Just like Iron Eyes Codie (pictured). who was first generation American born of two Italian immigrants. But, who, I might add, did far more to champion the cause of the Native American than Okla appears to be doing. JMHO
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He who gossips to u may also gossip about u.

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#171820 --- 05/22/05 11:10 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Ovidian Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 12/02/02
Posts: 11435
Loc: gone
I was wondering if you knew who he was.

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#171821 --- 05/22/05 04:32 PM Re: Going to Pieces
EYRIE Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 3279
Loc: Wherever Life leads me
Iron Eyes Codie? Who could ever forget him paddling up the poluted stream, and standing there with a single tear on his cheek. I found the picture under urban legends.
He may not have been a Native American by blood, but he did far more for the NA cause than any other person in modern history. I wonder what he would have thought of the dispute that has been going on for years in Seneca and Cayuga Counties.
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He who gossips to u may also gossip about u.

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#171822 --- 05/22/05 05:09 PM Re: Going to Pieces
Ovidian Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 12/02/02
Posts: 11435
Loc: gone
He was an actor. I doubt much beyond his paycheck mattered.

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#171823 --- 05/22/05 06:03 PM Re: Going to Pieces
EYRIE Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 3279
Loc: Wherever Life leads me
Check out his bio. I found it under crying indian, but he's also there under Iron Eyes Codie. His "credits" on behalf on the Native American are very impressive.
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He who gossips to u may also gossip about u.

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#171824 --- 05/22/05 11:16 PM Re: Going to Pieces
Okla.ndn Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/21/02
Posts: 3074
Loc: Osage Indian Nation in Oklahom...
Quote:

Sorry, Della. That remark was not intended as a general remark, but rather as a statement of my disappointment in one particular native American and his "noble cause".
No, unlike a lot of people who claim native american ancestry, I have no native American blood, nor did any of my ancestors come over on the Mayflower.
I am of northern and central European stock. Immigrants who came to this great country to escape their own form of persecution. Just like Iron Eyes Codie (pictured). who was first generation American born of two Italian immigrants. But, who, I might add, did far more to champion the cause of the Native American than Okla appears to be doing. JMHO


He was an actor I was born Native American. If he did so much then why are things the way they are for the Natives. Thats what I find odd people came here to escape persecution, then did the same thing to the Native Americans.
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I am a General Council member of the Seneca-Cayuga Tribe I speak for my self not my Tribe.

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#171825 --- 05/22/05 11:33 PM Re: Going to Pieces
EYRIE Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 3279
Loc: Wherever Life leads me
You seem to have missed the meaning of the message you copied.
Obviously you need to talk to some of the older members of your tribe. There was a time when the Native American was as persecuted and discriminated aginst as the Afridan American was 40 years ago.
I'm sorry, but you lost me when you colored your cause green.
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He who gossips to u may also gossip about u.

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#171826 --- 05/23/05 08:54 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Okla.ndn Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/21/02
Posts: 3074
Loc: Osage Indian Nation in Oklahom...
Quote:

You seem to have missed the meaning of the message you copied.
Obviously you need to talk to some of the older members of your tribe. There was a time when the Native American was as persecuted and discriminated aginst as the Afridan American was 40 years ago.
I'm sorry, but you lost me when you colored your cause green.


The judge colored it when he ruled we wouldn't get our land back. And it was our elders that filed the land claim. Your just one more that thinks its bad to defend ones self. I know I should be a good little ndn and be seen and not heard. LOL well think again joker this little ndn is going to speak and I don't give a rats ass what you think of me.
_________________________
I am a General Council member of the Seneca-Cayuga Tribe I speak for my self not my Tribe.

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#171827 --- 05/23/05 09:14 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY
I thought more of you before the statement about "getting richer".

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#171828 --- 05/23/05 09:20 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY
Quote:

are any of you Indian?




According to my family tree, there is Indian in my lineage. I am proud of that fact and have always cheered on various Indian benefits, for which I would never take a part in ( my "lineage" is not enough nor do I need it). But when I hear a Native American talking about getting richer off the backs of their fellow Americans, and laughing about it, it concerns me greatly. I guess my image of Indians of being spiritual beings was incorrect. I remember watching "cowboy and indians" as a kid, and being terrified of the thought of them as savages as they were so often protrayed. I no longer think they are "savages" in the sense they would cause harm to others. But to hear one say "we are getting richer and stronger...lol", well that bothers me a great deal. It is no longer about the land they claim to be hijacked from, nor the reparation for that land...it is about getting "rich". But, neither am I ignorant enough to believe that Okla speaks for ALL Native Americans, certainly not the ones who do not look at themselves as separted from our nation and continue to contribute to the society in which we all must live together. JMO

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#171829 --- 05/23/05 09:46 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Okla.ndn Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/21/02
Posts: 3074
Loc: Osage Indian Nation in Oklahom...
Quote:

I thought more of you before the statement about "getting richer".


And I hear the same thing every time you post. And my statement was to mean we now have the money to fight back. But I understand your statements to mean you don't think I have a right to fight for what was done to my forefathers. As long as its all one sided and we set back and take it you think more of us.
_________________________
I am a General Council member of the Seneca-Cayuga Tribe I speak for my self not my Tribe.

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#171830 --- 05/23/05 09:57 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY
No, I think you have a right to fight what you feel you have right to, this is America and should have equal rights. i just feel that the fight is being fought over and over again, and is not based on equality but for monetary strength. MY OPINION on your statement was based on what you posted. You did not post you wanted your land back, you did not state you were unfairly treated in that statement, you stated you were going to get "richer" and stronger. Anyone who makes the broad statement of getting richer because their forefathers were "unfairly treated", in my "opinion" sounds like they have lost focus on the issue, and just wants money in their pockets. Again, this is my opinion of you based on a post in a forum that you posted. Not on the entire population of Native Americans in the USA.
Laurie Pietowski comes to my mind of a Native American who stood up and proudly served this great Nation and made the supreme sacrifice. I have met and enjoyed the company of other not so well known NAs.
Do not infer from my post that I am "anti Native American", I am against someone who wants to get rich off the blood of their forefathers. Period.

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#171831 --- 05/23/05 10:18 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Okla.ndn Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/21/02
Posts: 3074
Loc: Osage Indian Nation in Oklahom...
We went to court to get the land back but the court ruled that we could only get money. So you think we should walk away and accept nothing because we couldn't get our land back. What money we have made didn't come from our land claim in New York. The land claim has done nothing but cost us money. "I am against someone who wants to get rich off the blood of their forefathers. Period." But you feel its okay that the white man has gotten rich off the blood of my forefathers. I would as soon have the land back as the money but that has been ruled on already by the court.
_________________________
I am a General Council member of the Seneca-Cayuga Tribe I speak for my self not my Tribe.

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#171832 --- 05/23/05 10:31 AM Re: Going to Pieces
Strawberry Jam Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 07/11/04
Posts: 34421
Loc: Herkimer County NY
I believe white men and other races, who have gotten rich off the blood of ANYONE is wrong. I am a white person who lives in the USA. I am not rich. I am not about to get rich off the blood of anyone.
Another broad statement that the 'white man" has caused you to be poor? How about a hard working individual who makes their way up the ladder? How about the hard wroking white person who works their way through college to become a successful businessman?
Quit throwing at me and others on here that we "owe" you something. My forefathers have also faced hard time, worked for everything they had and worked hard to get it.
Again, you argue "money for land". Yet you were already PAID for it long ago. You argue the treaty was "illegal" and now say the court says you cannot have the land but money. So if the USA pays you money this time for the land, will that be enough? Or will you again fight for the land that people will refuse to seel out to you for a price? And then again ask for more and more money each time you go to court to "fight" for land?
This is what I mean, the land was the issue, you are making it into money now. To make you "richer to fight", to fight what the same battle which funded your fight? Land? Yet you say you are not greedy? You want the money for the land because you cannot have the land and you need the money to fight for the land again? So you can get more money later??? Greed is what I hear, not pride in your "land" or people...greed.
Again, this is my opinion and you will not change it. It is my opinion of YOU Okla, by your posts, not all Native Americans. I know that most Native Americans have more pride than what you have shown here.

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#171833 --- 05/23/05 12:57 PM Re: Going to Pieces
EYRIE Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 3279
Loc: Wherever Life leads me
Quote:

I thought more of you before the statement about "getting richer".




Exactly my point, SBJ.
A question for Okla. What are you (the tribe as a whole) going to do if you do win this land back? Do you intend to come back to NYS and live on it?
No rhetoric, please. Just a simple answer to a simple question.
_________________________
He who gossips to u may also gossip about u.

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#171834 --- 05/23/05 03:00 PM Re: Going to Pieces
Rich_Tallcot Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 5565
Loc: Greeneville, TN
Okla says: "Your just one more that thinks its bad to defend ones self."

Ummmm: Okla, YOU are the plaintiff, WE are the DEFENDants.

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