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#1520744 --- 11/29/18 10:03 AM Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought
all seeing eye Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/05/07
Posts: 2238
Loc: Seneca Lake
Army to probe depot water

Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought


By DAVID L. SHAW
dshaw@fltimes.com

ROMULUS — The Army plans to investigate whether toxic chemicals related to the use of firefighting foam at the former Seneca Army Depot may be in groundwater “plumes” in central Seneca County.

Testing of groundwater in three areas determined that levels of perfluorooctanoic acid and perfluorooctane sulfonate — suspected carcinogenic chemicals associated with firefighting foam — are 1,327 times the federal health advisory limit.

New testing will be done in May 2019. The results would be used as the basis for determining whether a remediation program is needed or not, according to Randy Battaglia, environmental coordinator at the former depot.

“The sampling was done at the former air¬field refueling site, at a fire training pad, and at a fire training pit area,” Battaglia said. “Special probes were used, and they found contamination of the groundwater at the fire training area, not at the old airfield.”

No current depot ten¬ants use the groundwater as a source of drinking water. Rather, a public water supply is used, Battaglia said.

“The Army will do follow-up sampling in May to see if the contamination is getting off the depot property into properties outside the depot that use groundwater,” he said.

Battaglia said Earl Martin, who owns 7,000 acres of former depot land, has been informed of the sampling results. Battaglia said Martin plans to have any farm homestead or other users of water on his land hooked up to the public supply.

Some areas of the depot have restrictions on using groundwater. A feasibility study of the situation will be presented to the state Department of Environmental Conservation and the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency by Friday.

Battaglia said a public hearing will be scheduled for any remedial plan that is deemed necessary.

The U.S. Department of Defense uncovered the depot’s pollution problem during an investigation into 664 military sites nationwide that used fire¬fighting foam. That foam is believed to be the source of the contamination.

Perfluorooctanoic acid also was used in making non-stick Teflon pots and pans, and stain-resistant carpets. The EPA requires water systems serving at least 10,000 people to test for perfluorooctanoic acid and perfluorooctane sulfonate when they exceed 70 parts per trillion com¬bined in water samples.

The groundwater plumes would tend to migrate in a westerly di¬rection toward the area Martin has designated for Amish and Mennonite farmsteads, Battaglia said.

Groundwater plumes

According to the website www.dwa.gov.za, a groundwater contamination plume is a body of contaminated groundwater flowing from a specific source. The movement of the groundwater is influenced by such factors as local groundwater flow patterns, the character of the aquifer in which the groundwater is contained, and the density of contaminants. Contamination plumes are important because they can result in groundwater being less fit for use. The extent of the plume can be used to calculate the rate of contaminant migration.
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#1520745 --- 11/29/18 11:52 AM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: all seeing eye]
Hello_Governer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/03/11
Posts: 1635
Loc: New York, Seneca
Does anybody drink well water (ground water) anymore ? Good thing the EPA doesn't require private wells to be tested. Now you know why the state created Sampson State Park.


Edited by Hello_Governer (11/29/18 11:54 AM)
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#1520753 --- 11/29/18 01:24 PM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: Hello_Governer]
Wyatt Earp Offline
Member

Registered: 07/26/07
Posts: 283
Loc: Right behind you, Stilwell
Originally Posted By: Hello_Governer
Does anybody drink well water (ground water) anymore ? Good thing the EPA doesn't require private wells to be tested. Now you know why the state created Sampson State Park.


Newsflash!! Groundwater leaches into our streams and lakes. In addition, the food we eat "drinks" groundwater.
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#1520754 --- 11/29/18 01:25 PM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: Hello_Governer]
all seeing eye Offline
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Registered: 08/05/07
Posts: 2238
Loc: Seneca Lake
There are a number of houses and farms just outside the fence that are NOT on county water. Those wells need to be tested by the agencies investigating.

Also there are reports from Michigan that PFAS was found in deer meat near an air force base and the state issued a warning.

As part of Michigan’s efforts to identify PFAS in Michigan, deer were tested from areas known to have PFAS contamination in lakes or rivers. In October of 2018, MDHHS and DNR issued a ‘Do Not Eat’ advisory for deer taken within five miles of Clark’s Marsh in Oscoda Township. The advisory is due to high levels of PFAS chemicals found in deer taken within five miles of the Marsh.


Michigan Deer Alert PFAS

Guess those deer weren't on public water.
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#1520757 --- 11/29/18 03:17 PM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: Wyatt Earp]
Hello_Governer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/03/11
Posts: 1635
Loc: New York, Seneca
Originally Posted By: Wyatt Earp
Originally Posted By: Hello_Governer
Does anybody drink well water (ground water) anymore ? Good thing the EPA doesn't require private wells to be tested. Now you know why the state created Sampson State Park.


Newsflash!! Groundwater leaches into our streams and lakes. In addition, the food we eat "drinks" groundwater.
crazy
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#1520762 --- 11/29/18 06:32 PM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: all seeing eye]
Top Dog Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/00
Posts: 1994
Loc: Lap Dog
You guys! We are supposed to ignore this problem and only fight about the landfill.

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#1520763 --- 11/29/18 06:59 PM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: all seeing eye]
Gdog Offline
Member

Registered: 01/04/04
Posts: 329
I was involved in a bio-wall that was put in place some time ago. this was the latest idea the Feds had to keep the contamination from entering private property at the end of Smith Vineyard road in the Town of Romulus. If you think the fire fighting foam is the biggest contaminate on the Depot, you are completely in denial.

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#1520769 --- 11/30/18 08:42 PM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: Gdog]
Top Dog Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/00
Posts: 1994
Loc: Lap Dog
I believe you. I also think that the foam that washed airplanes was bad. In to the lakes with it while south county has shale just a few feet down.

Take a left at the landfill and the 55 gallon drums are dropped by Klionsky's guys.

Years ago before anyone cared. Today while nobody cares.

There is so much more.

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#1520770 --- 11/30/18 09:25 PM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: Top Dog]
scwoodchuck Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/22/14
Posts: 1955
Loc: LOST IN SPACE
I would still bet that obesity, drugs, prescription drugs and alcohol kill more people than anything else.
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#1520781 --- 12/03/18 04:12 PM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: scwoodchuck]
Hello_Governer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/03/11
Posts: 1635
Loc: New York, Seneca

Seneca County tops state in cirrhosis deaths ...
https://fingerlakes1.com/2018/04/02/seneca-county-tops-state-in...

While statistics show Seneca County has the highest cirrhosis death rate in the state, county public health officials said progress is being made to combat the issue.
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#1520783 --- 12/03/18 09:32 PM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: Gdog]
all seeing eye Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/05/07
Posts: 2238
Loc: Seneca Lake
I hear the "biowall" was "refreshed" for its 25th (silver) anniversary.

Any idea whether the changes were a result of "failure."

I have to say that a big "rubber" doesn't give me a lot of confidence that the pubic and environmental health have been protected from chemical contaminants.
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#1520784 --- 12/04/18 05:37 AM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: all seeing eye]
scwoodchuck Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/22/14
Posts: 1955
Loc: LOST IN SPACE
Originally Posted By: all seeing eye
I hear the "biowall" was "refreshed" for its 25th (silver) anniversary.

Any idea whether the changes were a result of "failure."

I have to say that a big "rubber" doesn't give me a lot of confidence that the pubic and environmental health have been protected from chemical contaminants.
Before you yell "FIRE" maybe you should wait till you see smoke. The government has been keeping a close eye on that depot for a very long time and there doesn't seem to be any health problems so far. You have a history of not knowing "HOW THINGS WORK". The authorities tend to use precautionary measures long before there is any evidence of a real problem. This country as a whole spends billions to safeguard the public, even from imaginary threats to human health. Excessive environmental regulations are bankrupting this country and have all but destroyed New York State's economy. If something isn't done about the global warming HOAX, you will be living in a third world country or worse. Unlike you two, I post links that are relevant to the topic and people really need to take the time to read that information.


Edited by scwoodchuck (12/04/18 05:38 AM)
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#1520785 --- 12/04/18 05:47 AM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: scwoodchuck]
scwoodchuck Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/22/14
Posts: 1955
Loc: LOST IN SPACE

[PDF]Cancer Incidence Investigation 1995-2014 Village of Hoosick Falls ...
https://www.health.ny.gov/environmental/investigations/hoosick/.../cancer_report.pdf
cancer cases in the Village of Hoosick Falls, and share new scientific findings ... one would expect to find, if cancer rates in the study area were the same as ..

To provide residents with information about cancer rates in the Village of
Hoosick Falls, NYS DOH analyzed results from New York State’s Cancer
Registry from January 1995 through December 2014 – the most recent year
for which complete data are available. No statistically significant elevations
of cancer were found for any of the cancer types associated with PFOA
exposure. The only cancer found to have a statistically significant elevation
was lung cancer, which has not been associated with PFOA exposure in any
study.
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#1520795 --- 12/04/18 09:37 PM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: scwoodchuck]
all seeing eye Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/05/07
Posts: 2238
Loc: Seneca Lake
The State Cancer registry is very limited in its applicability to particular locations as it ONLY collects address at time of diagnosis. It doesn't collect where you worked, lived previously, etc. and all analysis is by zip code of residence, not proximity to the site. It is designed to monitor cancer trends, not to do epidemiological studies, although politicians often try to do that.

Nor does it look at other related effects, like growth and development, reproduction, and liver illnesses.

Sorry, that report proves nothing.


Higher rates of Cancer, Illnesses following PFOA Exposure
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#1520816 --- 12/05/18 12:23 PM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: all seeing eye]
scwoodchuck Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/22/14
Posts: 1955
Loc: LOST IN SPACE
what would we do without newspapers and the opinion of a reporter who gets information from the internet
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#1520818 --- 12/05/18 12:48 PM Re: Army to probe depot water Toxic chemicals related to firefighting foam may be worse than originally thought [Re: scwoodchuck]
Formermac Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 11409
Loc: Above ground
As usual, local citizens are all so open minded, not so opinionated and listen to others when forming their personal thoughts. Seneca county has changed much since I left it a few back.

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