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#1513135 --- 02/08/18 07:21 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: pingu]
Tacitus Offline
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Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 214
Today's FLT indicates that the social mission & business offices of Trinity are now at 78 Castle Street, just 1 block away from St. Peter's. Maybe they can make the last step...

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#1514209 --- 04/19/18 09:03 AM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: Tacitus]
bluezone Offline
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Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32433
Loc: USA
if trinity gets the approval for their conversion would that be needed?
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"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1514812 --- 05/17/18 10:25 AM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: Tacitus]
bluezone Offline
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Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32433
Loc: USA
FL times states the Zone board approved the project to move forward
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"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1514863 --- 05/18/18 07:26 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: pingu]
Tacitus Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 214
I expect there will be some legal challenges from the neighbors. How this isn't an impact on the neighborhood id hard to accept.

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#1515599 --- 06/14/18 05:31 AM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: Tacitus]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32433
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Tacitus
How this isn't an impact on the neighborhood id hard to accept.


it is a large structure

if it were turned into a taxable property than it would need to generate considerable cash to pay for the taxes on the property

if it was converted to apartments there would still be people coming and going
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#1515646 --- 06/14/18 04:50 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: pingu]
Tacitus Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 214
1) You don't know what the taxes would be

2) Shouldn't rich properties pay their share - you're always going after HWS.

3) Compare, if you can, 30 apartment dwellers following a normal daily routine to 200 event attendees arriving, or departing, within a small amount of time.

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#1515673 --- 06/15/18 09:55 AM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: Tacitus]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32433
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Tacitus
1) You don't know what the taxes would be


the current city assessment is over $2 million for that property

if a developer spends a few million more dollars on improvements do you think the city will place the assessment at around only $50,000?

the assessment will exceed $2 million after a large amount of money is spent on improvements

the assessment will most likely double

Originally Posted By: Tacitus

2) Shouldn't rich properties pay their share


all properties should pay their fair share

Originally Posted By: Tacitus
3) Compare, if you can, 30 apartment dwellers following a normal daily routine to 200 event attendees arriving, or departing, within a small amount of time.


will those living in the apartments be allowed to have friends, family, guests... come over to visit?

HWS has large crowds
_________________________
"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1515684 --- 06/15/18 03:30 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: pingu]
Tacitus Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 214
Do you think any developer is going to put in a dime without a lucrative tax abatement agreement?

Do you think all of the apartment dwellers will all have large parties beginning and ending at the same time? HWS does have large crowds, but they also have a lot of parking. And you would expect something billed as an "events center" to have more events than HWS if they're going to stay in business.

Maybe this is the best place for the Popeye's Chicken - at least they could have a drive-thru window.

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#1515697 --- 06/16/18 07:21 AM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: Tacitus]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32433
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Tacitus
Do you think any developer is going to put in a dime without a lucrative tax abatement agreement?


the developer for this project has not mentioned any abatement terms

Originally Posted By: Tacitus
Do you think all of the apartment dwellers will all have large parties beginning and ending at the same time?


the point was thatthere would be more 'people traffic' than just those living there

Originally Posted By: Tacitus
HWS does have large crowds, but they also have a lot of parking.


parking overflows into neighboring streets for events at the HWS stadium

the perfomance center lacks enough parking

there is a lack of parking for students and staff during the school year


Originally Posted By: Tacitus
Maybe this is the best place for the Popeye's Chicken - at least they could have a drive-thru window.


grin

and how many customers would they need to serve daily to stay in business?

Originally Posted By: Tacitus
a normal daily routine to 200 event attendees


more than 200 per day?

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"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1515846 --- 06/19/18 04:23 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: pingu]
Tacitus Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 214
Between the neighborhood opposition and the difficulty in getting financing, I think this problem has solved itself.

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#1515859 --- 06/19/18 06:05 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: Tacitus]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32433
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Tacitus
I think this problem has solved itself.


how so?

if the building is abandoned, the roof fails, water destroys the structure...

is that how you consider it solved?


most likely HWS would buy it for a $1 at that point and turn it into student dorms

bet the neighbors would love that idea whistle


---- parrott hall on the cornell experiment campus ----
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"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1515861 --- 06/19/18 06:11 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: Tacitus]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32433
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Tacitus
Today's FLT indicates that the social mission & business offices of Trinity are now at 78 Castle Street, just 1 block away from St. Peter's. Maybe they can make the last step...



if you want the members of St Peters and the members at Trinity to combine

would it make more sense to move both into the Trinity location as there is more parking at the trinity location?

turn St Peters into senior housing?
_________________________
"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1515868 --- 06/20/18 04:38 AM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: pingu]
Tacitus Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 214
Right. Ask the large and growing parish with a superb music program to abandon their mission in downtown Geneva and move into the crumbling building with a dwindling, aging congregation so they can help all those impoverished souls on S. Main Street.

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#1516074 --- 06/25/18 06:18 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: Tacitus]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32433
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Tacitus
Ask the large and growing parish


and where do all those people park?

Originally Posted By: Tacitus
with a superb music program


is it the building that makes their music program superb?

Originally Posted By: Tacitus
to abandon their mission in downtown Geneva and move into the crumbling building


does St. Peters need a new roof?

are the gutters missing or falling off?

allowing large amounts of rain water (due to missing gutters/downspouts) to fall near the foundation will eventually undermine the soil causing the foundation to fail and cracks will appear in the walls

it would be rather expensive to repair the massive foundations that hold up the thick stone walls

how many months do they plan to keep a large piece of cardboard on a broken window?

Originally Posted By: Tacitus
with a dwindling, aging congregation so they can help all those impoverished souls on S. Main Street.


you suggested they merge with St Peters

the location on south main street has a larger parking area
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"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1516154 --- 06/28/18 03:15 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: Tacitus]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32433
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Tacitus
Between the neighborhood opposition and the difficulty in getting financing, I think this problem has solved itself.


local newspaper had a story saying the neighbors were bringing court action

if there is financing difficulty why would court action be needed by the neighbors?

rather than bringing court action the neighbors should suggest viable options for the future of the church

is it true that the neighbor bringing the court action also runs a B & B out of her property near the church?
_________________________
"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1516168 --- 06/28/18 04:59 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: pingu]
Tacitus Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 214
As predicted, the new lawsuit promises to tie up this project for another extended period. The building continues to deteriorate and the congregation dwindles.

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#1516199 --- 06/29/18 04:44 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: Tacitus]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32433
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Tacitus
the new lawsuit promises to tie up this project for another extended period.


it appears what you are saying is that those individuals on south main street against the project have not offered any viable solutions

Originally Posted By: Tacitus
The building continues to deteriorate


if the project moved forward would that be the case?

Originally Posted By: Tacitus
The building continues to deteriorate


does that increase the odds that hws will buy it, take it off the tax rolls and turn it into student housing?
_________________________
"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1516206 --- 06/30/18 07:52 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: pingu]
Tacitus Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 214
So it's up to the neighbors to offer an alternative to this scam?

If my home were in disrepair, I wouldn't ask my neighbors to fund the repairs, so why is this different?

Quit using HWS as the boogeyman in an issue that does;t involve this property.

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#1516502 --- 07/08/18 07:14 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: Tacitus]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32433
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Tacitus
So it's up to the neighbors to offer an alternative to this scam?


if they have a better option all they need to do is bring it forward

Originally Posted By: Tacitus
If my home were in disrepair, I wouldn't ask my neighbors to fund the repairs, so why is this different?


is the church asking for the neighbors to pay for the repairs?

Originally Posted By: Tacitus
Quit using HWS as the boogeyman in an issue that does;t involve this property.


you said financing may be a problem

does hws not have a sizable endowment where they could buy the property for only a $1 and then turn it into student housing?

has hws not created traffic and parking problems on south main street over the past 15 years?

where were the same neighbors then?
_________________________
"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1516506 --- 07/08/18 07:38 PM Re: Trinity Church Reuse [Re: pingu]
Tacitus Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 214
They don't need to have a better option, they just need to point out the damage to their neighborhood and violation of the planning document.

The church is asking the neighbors to accept a significant damage to their neighborhood with no compensation.

Maybe they don't need the housing, or the expense of bringing it up to code? It's not as if they have infinite funds. When the endowment is reduced, so are the earnings which support faculty salaries and scholarships.

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