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#1514700 --- 05/14/18 01:35 PM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: rock 963]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 14229
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: rock 963
In case any of you didn't know, Timbo got a thesaurus recently. Hey, can you look up any similar words for douche?

Always entertaining watching the illiterate attempt to compensate for their shortcomings by attacking those who aren't.

Clearly, I'M not the one in need of a thesaurus. But without looking, I'd bet that there are far MORE synonyms for the word ignoramus.
cool
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#1514701 --- 05/14/18 01:56 PM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: Sam the Sham]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 14229
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: Sam the Sham
Originally Posted By: IrieInFLX
In my opinion, it appears to be a race benefiting the director’s pocket book on the backs of tax payers and volunteers under the guise of benefitting the regions environment.

The smug response from J.A. in the Finger Lakes Times sealed my opinion. Sadly, instead of practicing journalistic integrity, FLT gave their crony a free pass and once again another outlet for J.A. to spew her garbage (as if every other week isn’t enough).

Hypocrisy and surreptitiousness is where I take issue. If it’s truly to raise awareness and benefit our environment, make it non-profit. If it’s a for profit business, great, but don’t narcissistically portray it as a gift to the region.

I’d be interested to know what amount in taxes were paid by this event.

The Times seems to be getting increasing insular, what with one columnist (Mitchell) allowed to attack potential business rivals such as the restaurants at the casino, another (Augustine) being allowed to defend/to promote her business and yet a third (Fitzgerald) allowed to write more or less the same column every week about a region not normally covered by the paper (Watkins Glen), in order to shill his fiction books.

The thing about a "non-profit" is that it can pay little, or no, taxes and still pay its directors an extremely generous salary.

The directors of the Seneca7 had better hope the volunteers and law enforcement agencies around the lake have short memories and forget this controversy by next year. I could see a few groups pull out to avoid participating in a "political" event.

You should do your homework. Watkins Glen is one of the specific areas covered regularly in the newspaper's distribution market. Furthermore, if meaningful, concise editorials are sent for consideration, the editors will likely print it.

What with all your pent-up acrimony, you'd be the perfect candidate to write your own insightful, print-worthy rebuttal. But, then again, it's probably just WAY easier to wank about it anonymously on some internet forum, instead.

The only smug or insular things going on around here, are all the snivelers complaining about a subject that they're too lazy to actually do something about. So, stop kvetching and write a well-reasoned letter to the editor.


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#1514705 --- 05/14/18 02:36 PM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: newsman38]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 14229
Loc: CNY

Since no one else can be bothered to get their facts straight, allow me...


From the Finger Lakes Times:
"Q: A Times reader emailed with the following question Monday: What is the meaning behind the burning flag and what looks like an anti-Trump picture on the race shirts that were the official race shirt of the Seneca7?

A: We went to the organizers of the event, Jackie Augustine and Jeff Henderson, for an answer.

First of all, Augustine replied with, “I can say right up front that nothing on the shirt is burning!”

They later issued a joint statement regarding the shirts:

“We’re surprised that this image, which has been on our website for over a month and received zero complaints, created such a social media firestorm in the past two days. We guess these days everyone wants to shout a political message over social media; we just choose not to.

“If taken in the context of the course guide and shirt design, it is clear that each symbol represents some element of the race, which has been focused on environmental protection, principles of zero waste, and Seneca Lake water quality from day one. Our finisher bottle for the first year included advocacy information from Gas Free Seneca, and we’ve focused on issues affecting our region every year since.

“For the past two years, the current administration has proposed funding cuts for the Great Lakes Restoration Initiative (this year’s proposal would have cut it by 90 percent) and it has taken bipartisan support in the House and Senate to get the funding restored. Local agencies receive monies from these sources to control invasive species in our Finger Lakes, and we are all better for it.

“If taken out of context, we guess people could think we’re taking a stand against mocking the disabled, running around with adult entertainers, bragging about sexual assault, or vilifying people from other countries. So be it. We set out eight years ago to produce an event that upholds our values and we are sticking to that.”"


From another article:
"The race itself has evolved into a major local platform for charitable giving, with more than $67,000 of donations made to more than 40 charities since 2011, according to race coordinator Jeff Henderson."
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#1514706 --- 05/14/18 02:43 PM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: Tacitus]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 14229
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: Tacitus
This is a profit-making event for her and her boyfriend. People come from all over to participate. Sponsors want their brand in front of those people. Doubtful that any backlash (however well-deserved) will be effective.

Do you have any actual evidence, or are you just committing libel?

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/libel
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#1514707 --- 05/14/18 02:49 PM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: Tacitus]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 14229
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: Tacitus
I repeat: this is a business, not a non-profit community endeavor. They give enough to charities to keep the volunteers coming, but IT'S A BUSINESS. They have carefully calculated the message that appeals to the sponsors and the runners (who pay, not donate). I'm not saying they are insincere, but they know their niche. If they lose a few Trump supporters my guess is that they sign up 10 times more who don't agree with his policies. Good business tactics.

Again... WHERE IS YOUR EVIDENCE? whistle
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#1514709 --- 05/14/18 03:13 PM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: newsman38]
Tacitus Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 217
The organization in question is not a non-profit, just look up their EIN. Or, better yet, Timbo, go ask them for a P & L statement for the race, I doubt if you'll get one.

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#1514710 --- 05/14/18 04:16 PM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: newsman38]
Sam the Sham Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/14/00
Posts: 683
Loc: USA
At Timbo's urging to research things, I went to the NYS Corporation database and was unable to find any listing for "Seneca7" or "One Million Revolutions" (the organization holding the copyright on the Seneca7 website) as a Not For Profit Corporation.

Maybe I was using the site incorrectly. If Timbo, or anyone else, wants to post a link showing their incorporation papers, 501(c)(3) filing or similar documents, I'd appreciate it.

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#1514711 --- 05/14/18 04:37 PM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: Tacitus]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 14229
Loc: CNY

Lack of evidence doesn't magically qualify as evidence. Additionally, I'm not the one making assertions. You are, and by extension, the onus falls upon YOU to provide the supporting evidence.

Debate 101, my friend.

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#1514712 --- 05/14/18 04:44 PM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: Sam the Sham]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 14229
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: Sam the Sham
At Timbo's urging to research things, I went to the NYS Corporation database and was unable to find any listing for "Seneca7" or "One Million Revolutions" (the organization holding the copyright on the Seneca7 website) as a Not For Profit Corporation.

Maybe I was using the site incorrectly. If Timbo, or anyone else, wants to post a link showing their incorporation papers, 501(c)(3) filing or similar documents, I'd appreciate it.


As would I.

I also checked the database for a few that I know for a fact are active and got a "no results" reply.
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#1514719 --- 05/14/18 06:33 PM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: newsman38]
Tacitus Offline
Member

Registered: 03/23/15
Posts: 217
OK - so it's a profit making entity. I don't have a problem with that, I never did. I just object to those who assume all of their motives are charitable.

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#1514724 --- 05/14/18 07:46 PM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: newsman38]
roundtable Offline
Member

Registered: 03/30/11
Posts: 116
Loc: new york state
So lets just keep bitching about it and drive the people who do all the work to a point where they say screw it, lets not even bother with this. A few people bust their A@S getting this event up and running. It brings people from many places to our area and they spend a little money here too. Its almost impossible to even get signed up for this event because it sells out in less than an hour. But hey Geneva..... lets do what we always do: bring it to a screeching halt and be rid of it, like we do and have done with so many other things here in this town. That s what we re best at..... stopping things from happening here. And you wonder why the young folks are graduating high school and leaving? Stop your bitching!

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#1514725 --- 05/14/18 11:28 PM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: Tacitus]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 14229
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: Tacitus
OK - so it's a profit making entity.

That has NOT been established.
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#1514732 --- 05/15/18 08:18 AM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: Timbo]
tubby Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/12/08
Posts: 1341
Loc: N.Y.
300 teams at $527 each equals $158,100 all volunteer workers no overhead and about $10,000 donated a year not a bad little profit.

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#1514733 --- 05/15/18 08:33 AM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: Sam the Sham]
Kells Offline
Member

Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 111
Originally Posted By: Sam the Sham
The directors of the Seneca7 had better hope the volunteers and law enforcement agencies around the lake have short memories and forget this controversy by next year. I could see a few groups pull out to avoid participating in a "political" event.


I think you may be underestimating the professionalism of law enforcement in our region. They don't "pull out" of providing safety at events because the events are political. Law enforcement, it may surprise you to know, actually provide their services at events that are purely political. Like political conventions, even. And white supremacist marches.

Law enforcement aren't actually volunteering their time for any of these events - they are providing a valuable service at a premium rate, often overtime rates, which events must pay as part of the permitting process. Thus, they can afford to be apolitical, and not "pull out" of events because they disagree with a flag on a t-shirt.

As for volunteers, it is true that there may be some die-hard Trump lovers who would prioritize their love for Trump over all else. I think that number is growing smaller every day, though.


Edited by Kells (05/15/18 08:36 AM)

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#1514734 --- 05/15/18 08:42 AM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: tubby]
Kells Offline
Member

Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 111
Originally Posted By: tubby
300 teams at $527 each equals $158,100 all volunteer workers no overhead and about $10,000 donated a year not a bad little profit.


Your math sucks.

Still, I would like to read your analysis on these events impact on the local economy next. Please continue with the #tubbymath.

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#1514735 --- 05/15/18 08:45 AM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: roundtable]
Kells Offline
Member

Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 111
Originally Posted By: roundtable
So lets just keep bitching about it and drive the people who do all the work to a point where they say screw it, lets not even bother with this. A few people bust their A@S getting this event up and running. It brings people from many places to our area and they spend a little money here too. Its almost impossible to even get signed up for this event because it sells out in less than an hour. But hey Geneva..... lets do what we always do: bring it to a screeching halt and be rid of it, like we do and have done with so many other things here in this town. That s what we re best at..... stopping things from happening here. And you wonder why the young folks are graduating high school and leaving? Stop your bitching!


I've been saying this for years... if you only came to the FingerLakes1.com forums you would think Geneva and the surrounding area was against these events, and you might wonder why anything takes place here. Actually get out and GO to the events, though, and you'll be caught up in the spirit of them. Get out and volunteer at some of these, and you won't be sorry!

The disgruntlement that has become much of these forums is NOT easily found out in the community.

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#1514737 --- 05/15/18 09:16 AM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: Kells]
roundtable Offline
Member

Registered: 03/30/11
Posts: 116
Loc: new york state
Kells... you are correct. Ive participated in the event for several years. Ive had friends come here from out of town to run as well. Its a great event and it must take a ton of planning on the planners part. Why do these sedentary folks who get on their computers and spew negative thoughts even care about it. I would agree..... most of them probably dont really know what its like to be a part of this event..... they just bitch and complain. However..... I ve noticed this happens for almost every thing that tries to happen here from way back..... back before the forums. Resist any change that may brighten our city in any way or even bring people here to boost our economy..... As I said prior.... its what Geneva does best.

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#1514738 --- 05/15/18 09:30 AM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: roundtable]
tubby Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/12/08
Posts: 1341
Loc: N.Y.
I have volunteered at one of the exchange points for the past three years and agree it is a great event for the area my reply was to Timbo merely stating that it is definitely for profit.

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#1514739 --- 05/15/18 10:12 AM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: tubby]
Kells Offline
Member

Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 111
Originally Posted By: tubby
I have volunteered at one of the exchange points for the past three years and agree it is a great event for the area my reply was to Timbo merely stating that it is definitely for profit.


Well, then, here's something you'll rarely see on this forum... my apologies then. Volunteering is awesome!

The 'no overhead' though, leaves out the many things events are required to pay for, like permits, venue rentals, law enforcement OT pay, and more. I'm sure that many of these events can be very profitable, but there are many around the country that don't make it to the next year because organizers couldn't figure out how to turn a profit.

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#1514740 --- 05/15/18 10:17 AM Re: Anti-Trump Seneca7 shirt controversy [Re: roundtable]
Kells Offline
Member

Registered: 04/16/15
Posts: 111
Originally Posted By: roundtable
Kells... you are correct. Ive participated in the event for several years. Ive had friends come here from out of town to run as well. Its a great event and it must take a ton of planning on the planners part. Why do these sedentary folks who get on their computers and spew negative thoughts even care about it. I would agree..... most of them probably dont really know what its like to be a part of this event..... they just bitch and complain. However..... I ve noticed this happens for almost every thing that tries to happen here from way back..... back before the forums. Resist any change that may brighten our city in any way or even bring people here to boost our economy..... As I said prior.... its what Geneva does best.


My grandfather used to tell me that Geneva was made up of two camps: those who were for, and those who were against. "Against what, Grandpa?" "Against anything and everything."

Not much has changed in all these years, it seems. At least the 'against' crowd seem to stick to themselves and complain in a group while the 'for' folks do their thing.

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