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#1503261 --- 08/12/17 09:07 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: kyle585]
gassy one Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/27/16
Posts: 1970
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Originally Posted By: Timbo
You say that Russia is "fake news" and you want the "liberal media" to stop talking about it? Well, here's the problem:
If you keep lying, then we'll keep digging. And eventually, Mueller is gonna serve up Trump's Keister on a platter![/size]
They got nothing BIMBO! Partisan politics at it's finest!
My god. You can read all that and still saying they got nothing?????? Your head is really buried in the sand.
NOTHING KYLE NOTHING!!!

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#1503268 --- 08/12/17 09:23 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: gassy one]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 15769
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Originally Posted By: Timbo
You say that Russia is "fake news" and you want the "liberal media" to stop talking about it? Well, here's the problem:
If you keep lying, then we'll keep digging. And eventually, Mueller is gonna serve up Trump's Keister on a platter![/size]
They got nothing BIMBO! Partisan politics at it's finest!
My god. You can read all that and still saying they got nothing?????? Your head is really buried in the sand.
NOTHING KYLE NOTHING!!!
I got to wonder. Are you really this blind?

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#1503276 --- 08/12/17 09:32 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: kyle585]
gassy one Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/27/16
Posts: 1970
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Originally Posted By: Timbo
You say that Russia is "fake news" and you want the "liberal media" to stop talking about it? Well, here's the problem:
If you keep lying, then we'll keep digging. And eventually, Mueller is gonna serve up Trump's Keister on a platter![/size]
They got nothing BIMBO! Partisan politics at it's finest!
My god. You can read all that and still saying they got nothing?????? Your head is really buried in the sand.
NOTHING KYLE NOTHING!!!
I got to wonder. Are you really this blind?
They got no proof of anything Kyle! Just circumstantial evidence!

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#1503283 --- 08/12/17 09:40 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: gassy one]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 15769
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: gassy one
They got no proof of anything Kyle! Just circumstantial evidence!
Oh you an expert on what Mueller has? With 16 top notch attorneys in all types of legal work on his staff now?

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#1503285 --- 08/12/17 09:41 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: gassy one]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 15769
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: gassy one
They got no proof of anything Kyle! Just circumstantial evidence!
Bimbo posted on here showing how many of Trumps key people have ties to Russia. I know you saw it. That is far too much smoke for their to be no fire.

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#1503292 --- 08/12/17 09:49 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: kyle585]
gassy one Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/27/16
Posts: 1970
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: gassy one
They got no proof of anything Kyle! Just circumstantial evidence!
Bimbo posted on here showing how many of Trumps key people have ties to Russia. I know you saw it. That is far too much smoke for their to be no fire.
Ties doesn't equal CRIMES!

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#1503302 --- 08/12/17 09:59 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: gassy one]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 15769
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: gassy one
They got no proof of anything Kyle! Just circumstantial evidence!
Bimbo posted on here showing how many of Trumps key people have ties to Russia. I know you saw it. That is far too much smoke for their to be no fire.
Ties doesn't equal CRIMES!
Oh these are the ties that bind.

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#1503308 --- 08/12/17 10:07 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: kyle585]
gassy one Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/27/16
Posts: 1970
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: gassy one
They got no proof of anything Kyle! Just circumstantial evidence!
Bimbo posted on here showing how many of Trumps key people have ties to Russia. I know you saw it. That is far too much smoke for their to be no fire.
Ties doesn't equal CRIMES!
Oh these are the ties that bind.
Yeah OK! Almost as good as the polls saying Trump had no way of winning! ROFLMAO!

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#1503395 --- 08/15/17 02:32 AM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: gassy one]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 15769
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: gassy one
They got no proof of anything Kyle! Just circumstantial evidence!
Bimbo posted on here showing how many of Trumps key people have ties to Russia. I know you saw it. That is far too much smoke for their to be no fire.
Ties doesn't equal CRIMES!
Oh these are the ties that bind.
Yeah OK! Almost as good as the polls saying Trump had no way of winning! ROFLMAO!
I notice you, just like Trump, cite polls when they show what you believe.

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#1503403 --- 08/15/17 08:03 AM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: gassy one]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 15769
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: gassy one
They got no proof of anything Kyle! Just circumstantial evidence!
OMG. I just saw this guy Adam Davidson on TV. They have got so much to look into it will take Mueller a long time to go through all this.

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2017/08/21/trumps-business-of-corruption

President Donald Trump’s attorney Jay Sekulow recently told me that the investigation being led by Robert Mueller, the special counsel appointed by the Justice Department, should focus on one question: whether there was “coördination between the Russian government and people on the Trump campaign.” Sekulow went on, “I want to be really specific. A real-estate deal would be outside the scope of legitimate inquiry.” If he senses “drift” in Mueller’s investigation, he said, he will warn the special counsel’s office that it is exceeding its mandate. The issue will first be raised “informally,” he noted. But if Mueller and his team persist, Sekulow said, he might lodge a formal objection with the Deputy Attorney General, Rod Rosenstein, who has the power to dismiss Mueller and end the inquiry. President Trump has been more blunt, hinting to the Times that he might fire Mueller if the investigation looks too closely at his business dealings.

Several news accounts have confirmed that Mueller has indeed begun to examine Trump’s real-estate deals and other business dealings, including some that have no obvious link to Russia. But this is hardly wayward. It would be impossible to gain a full understanding of the various points of contact between the Kremlin and the Trump campaign without scrutinizing many of the deals that Trump has made in the past decade. Trump-branded buildings in Toronto and the SoHo neighborhood of Manhattan were developed in association with people who have connections to the Kremlin. Other real-estate partners of the Trump Organization—in Brazil, India, Indonesia, and elsewhere—are now caught up in corruption probes, and, collectively, they suggest that the company had a pattern of working with partners who exploited their proximity to political power.

One foreign deal, a stalled 2011 plan to build a Trump Tower in Batumi, a city on the Black Sea in the Republic of Georgia, has not received much journalistic attention. But the deal, for which Trump was reportedly paid a million dollars, involved unorthodox financial practices that several experts described to me as “red flags” for bank fraud and money laundering; moreover, it intertwined his company with a Kazakh oligarch who has direct links to Russia’s President, Vladimir Putin. As a result, Putin and his security services have access to information that could put them in a position to blackmail Trump. (Sekulow said that “the Georgia real-estate deal is something we would consider out of scope,” adding, “Georgia is not Russia.”)

Darden explained that Kazakh intelligence agents work closely with their Russian counterparts. Kulibayev himself has direct ties to Russia’s leadership. In 2011, he was named to the board of Gazprom, the Russian gas behemoth, which is widely considered to be a pillar of Putin’s fortune. In “The Return: Russia’s Journey from Gorbachev to Medvedev,” Daniel Treisman, a political scientist at U.C.L.A. who specializes in Russia, wrote, “For Putin, Gazprom was a personal obsession. He memorized the details of the company’s accounts, its pricing rules and pipeline routes. He personally approved all appointments down to the deputy level, sometimes forgetting to tell the company’s actual C.E.O., Aleksey Miller.” Kulibayev could not possibly be serving on Gazprom’s board without Putin’s assent.

Robert Mueller has assembled a team of sixteen lawyers. One of them is fluent in Russian, and five have extensive experience investigating and prosecuting cases of money laundering, foreign corruption, and complex financial conspiracies. The path from Trump to Putin, if one exists, might be found in one of his foreign real-estate deals.

When Mueller was appointed special counsel, his official writ was to investigate not just “any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump” but also “any matters that arose or may arise directly from the investigation.” Much hinges on the word “directly.” Sekulow, Trump’s lawyer, insists that Mueller’s mandate essentially stops at the Russian border. Pawneet Abramowski, a former F.B.I. intelligence analyst, told me that Sekulow’s assertion is nonsensical. “You must follow the clues,” she said. When investigating a businessperson like Trump, “you have to follow the money and go wherever it leads—you must follow the clues all the way to the end.” &#9830;

So many partners of the Trump Organization have been fined, sued, or criminally investigated for financial crimes that it is hard to ascribe the pattern to coincidence, or even to shoddy due diligence. In criminal law, there is a crucial concept called “willful blindness”: a person can be convicted of a crime even if he was unaware of certain aspects of the crime in which he was engaged. In U.S. courts, judges routinely explain to juries that “no one can avoid responsibility for a crime by deliberately ignoring what is obvious.

A month after Trump visited Georgia, he agreed to license his name to, and provide oversight of, a luxury hotel in Baku, Azerbaijan, a deal that I examined in an article in The New Yorker earlier this year. Trump received several million dollars from the brother and the son of an Azerbaijani billionaire who was then the Minister of Transportation—a man who, U.S. officials believe, may have been simultaneously laundering money for the Iranian Revolutionary Guard. In 2013, Trump met with the Azerbaijani-Russian billionaire Aras Agalarov and his son, Emin; that November, they partnered with Trump on the Miss Universe contest, in Moscow, and discussed building a Trump Tower in the Russian capital. In June, 2016, at Emin Agalarov’s request, Trump, Jr., met with Natalia Veselnitskaya, a lawyer who has represented Russian intelligence. Trump, Jr., was promised damaging information about Hillary Clinton. Veselnitskaya came to the meeting accompanied by business associates who have extensive ties to Georgia and Azerbaijan.

A judge in the U.K. ruled repeatedly against Ablyazov, starting in 2009, and ordered him to hand over more than four billion dollars to B.T.A. (The Kazakh government insisted that six billion dollars more remained missing.) The judge, Sir Nigel John Martin Teare, said that Ablyazov’s use of offshore holding companies had facilitated “fraud on an epic scale.” Teare ruled that “there can be only one explanation for the fact that the very large sums of money which were advanced were immediately transferred to companies owned or controlled by Mr. Ablyazov, namely, that the original loans were part of a dishonest scheme whereby Mr. Ablyazov sought to misappropriate monies which belonged to the bank.” Ablyazov was eventually sentenced to twenty-two months in a U.K. prison, for contempt of court, because he had refused to reveal disputed assets. In February, 2012, when Trump was planning his trip to Georgia, Ablyazov fled to France. He is currently fighting extradition.

In 2010, when a Trump Organization executive, Michael Cohen, began negotiating with the Silk Road Group about licensing Trump’s name for the Batumi tower, Ablyazov was facing eleven lawsuits in the U.K. The Kazakh government, which had indeed seized control of B.T.A. Bank, had sued him to reclaim ten billion dollars that he had allegedly siphoned out of the country. The Financial Times covered the case extensively, as did the Times, which described “a scheme by B.T.A.’s former chairman, Mukhtar Ablyazov, to direct between $8 billion and $12 billion worth of B.T.A. loans—about half of the bank’s loan book—to companies that he secretly controlled.” The article noted that Ablyazov was renting “a 15,000-square-foot mansion” in London.

It would have taken only a Google search for the Trump Organization to discover that the Silk Road Group had received much of its funding from B.T.A. Bank, which, at the time of the Batumi deal, was mired in one of the largest fraud cases in recent history. The Silk Road Group had even been business partners with the central figure in the scandal: Ablyazov and the Silk Road Group were two of the owners of a bank in Georgia. I asked Cohen, who visited Georgia with Trump, if he had been concerned about the Silk Road Group’s connection to B.T.A. Bank. “I didn’t even know that B.T.A. was involved in this entire scenario up until the moment you told me,” he said. He added that he was not aware of any information about how the tower would be funded—or even “if there was going to be any funding at all.” He went on, “We had not gotten to that stage of the process. Remember, this was a licensing deal. The financing of the project was the responsibility of the licensee”—the Silk Road Group.

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#1503411 --- 08/15/17 01:10 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: gassy one]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 13470
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: gassy one
They got no proof of anything Kyle! Just circumstantial evidence!

TONS of circumstantial evidence. Which, since you clearly don't understand, is enough for a conviction. smirk

There doesn't have to be conclusive evidence.

Read a law book some time.
_________________________
Everyone's entitled to their own opinions, but not their own facts.

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#1503413 --- 08/15/17 01:27 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: kyle585]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 15769
Loc: Somewhere out there
http://www.thedailybeast.com/paul-manafo...lleged-gangster

Paul Manafort Sought $850 Million Deal With Putin Ally and Alleged Gangster

Trump’s one-time campaign chairman has a history of unorthodox real-estate deals. But this may have been the wildest of all.

Paul Manafort partnered on an $850 million New York real-estate deal with an ally of Vladimir Putin and a Ukrainian moneyman whom the Justice Department recently described as an “organized-crime member.”

That’s according a 2008 memo written by Rick Gates, Manafort’s business partner and fellow alumnus of Donald Trump’s presidential campaign. In it, Gates enthused about finalizing with the financing necessary to acquire New York’s louche Drake Hotel.

Two former federal prosecutors told The Daily Beast that the hotel deal was likely to be an item of focus for special counsel Robert Mueller’s inquiry into ties between Trump associates and the Kremlin.

Some White House officials, who spoke to The Daily Beast on condition of anonymity, are also wary. They feel Manafort may have made President Trump more legally vulnerable through his decades of business deals with foreign governments and shady Eastern European power brokers. Those deals, these White House aides suspect, led federal investigators down a money trail that threatens to plunge the Trump White House further into legal jeopardy.

Asked whether any Manafort deals seemed particularly troubling in retrospect, a senior administration official replied, “You mean like this one?” and appended a link to a 2016 story on Manafort’s alleged attempts to launder a Ukrainian oil and gas billionaire’s ill-gotten fortune through New York real estate—including the Drake.

The Justice Department is now seeking the extradition of that billionaire, Dmitry Firtash, so he can stand trial for a 2013 racketeering indictment in a Chicago federal court. Two weeks ago, in response to a legal filing from Firtash seeking dismissal of the case, the acting U.S. attorney in Chicago termed Firtash and a deputy as “two organized-crime members” and people “identified by United States law enforcement as two upper-echelon associates of Russian organized crime.” Years before the indictment, Firtash was a major moneyman for the Party of Regions in Ukraine, the pro-Kremlin political faction for which Manafort consulted.

Renato Mariotti, a former federal prosecutor in Chicago, considered the Drake deal to be significant to Mueller’s inquiry.

“There’s no question that Mueller is gonna be interested in communications between Manafort and individuals who are close to Putin & the Russian government,” Mariotti said.

“The fact that Manafort has a close business relationship with at least two of these people means that Mueller will scour Manafort’s finances and the records of these transactions to determine what benefits Manafort received and whether he owed something to these individuals. He’ll also look to see anything about Manafort’s relationship with these individuals that could have been used as leverage by them.”

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#1503414 --- 08/15/17 01:42 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: kyle585]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 15769
Loc: Somewhere out there
WASHINGTON &#8213; Weeks before a violent white supremacist rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, led to three deaths and 19 injuries, the Trump administration revoked a grant to Life After Hate, a group that works to de-radicalize neo-Nazis.

The Department of Homeland Security had awarded the group $400,000 as part of its Countering Violent Extremism program in January, just days before former President Barack Obama left office. It was the only group selected for a grant that focused exclusively on fighting white supremacy. But the grant money was not immediately disbursed.

Trump aides, including Katharine Gorka, a controversial national security analyst known for her anti-Muslim rhetoric, were already working toward eliminating Life After Hate’s grant and to direct all funding toward fighting what the president has described as “radical Islamic terrorism.”

In December, Gorka, then a member of Trump’s transition team, met with George Selim, the DHS official who headed the Countering Violent Extremism program until he resigned last month, and his then-deputy, David Gersten.

Gorka told Selim and Gersten she didn’t agree with the Obama administration’s approach to countering violent extremism &#8213; particularly the way the administration had described the threat of extremism, according to Nate Snyder, an Obama administration DHS counterterrorism official who was an adviser on Countering Violent Extremism efforts and was given a readout of the meeting. The Trump administration has repeatedly criticized the previous administration for avoiding terms like “radical Islam” out of concern that it could alienate Muslims in the U.S. and abroad.

“That was sort of foreshadowing what was going to come,” Snyder said of the December meeting.

Gorka and Selim did not immediately respond to requests for comment.

“Katharine Gorka has been integral in helping the Department broaden efforts to focus on all forms of extremism. Her work includes efforts to address everything from global jihadists threats to domestic terrorists,” Anna Franko, a DHS spokeswoman, wrote in an email.

Gorka and her husband, Sebastian Gorka, also a Trump White House official, have collaborated on numerous writings about the threat of radical Islam. Though they have a large following within far-right circles &#8213; they both have bylines at Breitbart News &#8213; mainstream national security experts are either unfamiliar with or critical of their work.

The day after Trump won the election, Sebastian Gorka said, “I predict with absolute certitude, the jettisoning of concepts such as CVE.”

Once Trump entered the White House in January, the office of then-DHS Secretary John Kelly ordered a full review of the Countering Violent Extremism program. Kelly’s office wanted to re-vet the groups receiving a portion of the $10 million Congress had appropriated for the program — even though DHS had already publicly announced the grant recipients.

While that review was underway, DHS and the FBI warned in an internal intelligence bulletin of the threat posed by white supremacy. White supremacists “were responsible for 49 homicides in 26 attacks from 2000 to 2016 … more than any other domestic extremist movement,” the two agencies wrote in a May 10 document obtained by Foreign Policy. Members of the white supremacist movement “likely will continue to pose a threat of lethal violence over the next year,” they concluded.


Edited by kyle585 (08/15/17 01:42 PM)

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#1503418 --- 08/15/17 03:15 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: kyle585]
Teonan Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/30/12
Posts: 4768
Loc: West End

Let this sink in...

"DHS and the FBI warned in an internal intelligence bulletin of the threat posed by white supremacy. White supremacists “were responsible for 49 homicides in 26 attacks from 2000 to 2016 … more than any other domestic extremist movement,” the two agencies wrote in a May 10 document obtained by Foreign Policy. Members of the white supremacist movement “likely will continue to pose a threat of lethal violence over the next year,” they concluded."

Joint Intelligence Bulletin
Read on: https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/3924852-White-Supremacist-Extremism-JIB.html
_________________________
"Everything that has ever happened to us is there to make us stronger."
-John Trudell


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#1503426 --- 08/15/17 09:43 PM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: kyle585]
gassy one Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/27/16
Posts: 1970
Originally Posted By: kyle585
WASHINGTON &#8213; Weeks before a violent white supremacist rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, led to three deaths and 19 injuries, the Trump administration revoked a grant to Life After Hate, a group that works to de-radicalize neo-Nazis.

The Department of Homeland Security had awarded the group $400,000 as part of its Countering Violent Extremism program in January, just days before former President Barack Obama left office. It was the only group selected for a grant that focused exclusively on fighting white supremacy. But the grant money was not immediately disbursed.

Trump aides, including Katharine Gorka, a controversial national security analyst known for her anti-Muslim rhetoric, were already working toward eliminating Life After Hate’s grant and to direct all funding toward fighting what the president has described as “radical Islamic terrorism.”

In December, Gorka, then a member of Trump’s transition team, met with George Selim, the DHS official who headed the Countering Violent Extremism program until he resigned last month, and his then-deputy, David Gersten.

Gorka told Selim and Gersten she didn’t agree with the Obama administration’s approach to countering violent extremism &#8213; particularly the way the administration had described the threat of extremism, according to Nate Snyder, an Obama administration DHS counterterrorism official who was an adviser on Countering Violent Extremism efforts and was given a readout of the meeting. The Trump administration has repeatedly criticized the previous administration for avoiding terms like “radical Islam” out of concern that it could alienate Muslims in the U.S. and abroad.

“That was sort of foreshadowing what was going to come,” Snyder said of the December meeting.

Gorka and Selim did not immediately respond to requests for comment.

“Katharine Gorka has been integral in helping the Department broaden efforts to focus on all forms of extremism. Her work includes efforts to address everything from global jihadists threats to domestic terrorists,” Anna Franko, a DHS spokeswoman, wrote in an email.

Gorka and her husband, Sebastian Gorka, also a Trump White House official, have collaborated on numerous writings about the threat of radical Islam. Though they have a large following within far-right circles &#8213; they both have bylines at Breitbart News &#8213; mainstream national security experts are either unfamiliar with or critical of their work.

The day after Trump won the election, Sebastian Gorka said, “I predict with absolute certitude, the jettisoning of concepts such as CVE.”

Once Trump entered the White House in January, the office of then-DHS Secretary John Kelly ordered a full review of the Countering Violent Extremism program. Kelly’s office wanted to re-vet the groups receiving a portion of the $10 million Congress had appropriated for the program — even though DHS had already publicly announced the grant recipients.

While that review was underway, DHS and the FBI warned in an internal intelligence bulletin of the threat posed by white supremacy. White supremacists “were responsible for 49 homicides in 26 attacks from 2000 to 2016 … more than any other domestic extremist movement,” the two agencies wrote in a May 10 document obtained by Foreign Policy. Members of the white supremacist movement “likely will continue to pose a threat of lethal violence over the next year,” they concluded.
Waste of taxpayer money! Put them in jail instead! You are not going to rehabilitate people like that!

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#1503448 --- 08/16/17 12:48 AM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: gassy one]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 15769
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Waste of taxpayer money! Put them in jail instead! You are not going to rehabilitate people like that!
Yes put the neo-Nazi's and KKK in jail.

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#1503463 --- 08/16/17 07:55 AM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: gassy one]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 15769
Loc: Somewhere out there
http://theweek.com/speedreads/718718/tru...elow-30-percent

Poll Watch

Trump's favorite poll says his strong approval rating is below 30 percent
8:50 a.m. ET

President Trump has praised Rasmussen Reports for producing "the most accurate" polls, although the latest news from the polling company might not have him so thrilled. As of Tuesday, Rasmussen finds Trump's "strong" approval rating is a mere 26 percent, while 45 percent of people "strongly disapprove" of the job he is doing in office.

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#1503464 --- 08/16/17 07:56 AM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: kyle585]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 15769
Loc: Somewhere out there
Morning Joe co-host Joe Scarborough did nothing to hide his disgust over President Trump's comments Tuesday regarding Charlottesville. "He has now officially become the president not only of America but also of the white nationalist movement," Scarborough told viewers Wednesday.

Lawmakers from both parties, including House Speaker Paul Ryan (R-Wis.), Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.), and 2012 GOP presidential nominee Mitt Romney, took issue with Trump's moral equivalency Tuesday between neo-Nazis and those opposed to them, and Trump's statement that some of the alt-right protesters are "very nice people." Trump's comments received positive reviews from former KKK leader David Duke and alt-right organizer Richard Spencer.

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#1503472 --- 08/16/17 11:26 AM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: kyle585]
luckyduck Offline
Member

Registered: 06/15/11
Posts: 253
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Waste of taxpayer money! Put them in jail instead! You are not going to rehabilitate people like that!
Yes put the neo-Nazi's and KKK in jail.


History shows that mob rule doesn't usually work out too well. How about we instead only throw in jail those who have broken a law?

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#1503473 --- 08/16/17 11:57 AM Re: Russia Probe to Grand Jury [Re: luckyduck]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 15769
Loc: Somewhere out there
http://www.newsweek.com/roll-call-republicans-who-oppose-trump-getting-longer-day-heres-list-651310

The Roll Call of Republicans Who Oppose Trump Is Getting Longer By The Day. Here's The List
By Ronald L. Feinman On 8/16/17 at 6:20 AM

After six months of the Donald Trump Presidency, it is clear that there are a large number of conservatives and Republicans who have repudiated everything that Donald Trump represents, creating a larger opposition to a Republican President than we have ever seen from within the party and the conservative movement in the years since World War II.

Ordinarily, one would think that conservative ideologues and Republican officeholders would remain silent, but that is as far from reality in 2017 as one can possibly imagine.

Daily Emails and Alerts - Get the best of Newsweek delivered to your inbox

While many Republicans, including Speaker of the House Paul Ryan and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell, continue to hold their fire about Trump’s behavior, there are many who have no problem in being critical of how Trump conducts himself in the Presidency.

Three women Senators—Susan Collins of Maine, Lisa Murkowski of Alaska, Shelley Moore Capito of West Virginia—have openly split with the President on health care and often have shown discontent with Trump’s heavy handed approach to governing.

Senators Dean Heller of Nevada and Jeff Flake of Arizona, both facing tough re-election contests in 2018, are clearly uncomfortable having to deal with the President’s bullyism tactics.

Senators John McCain of Arizona, Lindsey Graham of South Carolina, Marco Rubio of Florida, Rand Paul of Kentucky, Mike Lee of Utah, Rob Portman of Ohio, Bob Corker and Lamar Alexander of Tennessee, and Ben Sasse of Nebraska, have expressed doubts about Trump’s leadership.

Representatives have also split with Trump.

Ileana Ros-Lehtinen of Florida, and Justin Amash of Michigan, Charlie Dent of Pennsylvania and Adam Kinzinger of Illinois are among those who for various reasons have joined the Trump critics, as well as former Congressmen Joe Scarborough of Florida and J. C. Watts of Oklahoma.

Then there are the GOP governors.

John Kasich of Ohio and Brian Sandoval of Nevada have worked against Trump on the issue of health care. Also, Susana Martinez of New Mexico, Charlie Baker of Massachusetts, and Larry Hogan of Maryland have been strong critics, as well as former New Jersey Governor Christine Todd Whitman and former California Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger.

Also, conservative Evan McMullin, who ran as an Independent in the 2016 Presidential election, gaining one half of one percent of the total national vote, and 725,000 popular votes, has become a strong and regular critic of the constitutional dangers that Donald Trump represents.

Among conservative pundits drawn from journalism, the academy, and think tanks, there is much more strong opposition to everything Donald Trump represents. The list of critics is massive, and not all figures engaged in opposition can be included, as there is no possibility of a complete list.

The anti Trump world, however, would include in alphabetical order the following: Glenn Beck, Max Boot, L. Brent Bozell, David Brooks, Mona Charen, Ross Douthat, Erick Erickson, Niall Ferguson, David Frum, Robert George, Michael Gerson, Jonah Goldberg, Stephen Hayes, Margaret Hoover, Robert Kagan, Charles Krauthammer, Bill Kristol, Matt Lewis, Dana Loesch, Rich Lowry, Meghan McCain, Michael Medved, Russell Moore, Michael Mukasey, Charles Murray, Ana Navarro, Peggy Noonan, Daniel Pipes, John Podhoretz, Karl Rove, Jennifer Rubin, Steve Schmidt, Thomas Sowell, Ken Starr, Michael Steele, Bret Stephens, Charlie Sykes, Cal Thomas, Nicole Wallace, George Will, and Montel Williams, and, among others.

Many of the major conservative media, including the National Review, the Weekly Standard , and the Wall Street Journal have had many of their editors and contributors turn against Donald Trump.

Many retired intelligence officials, including James Woolsey, James Clapper, and Michael Hayden have also spoken out strongly against the President, as has former State Department official R. Nicholas Burns and former National Security Adviser Brent Scowcroft.

Also, former Presidents George H. W. Bush and George W. Bush, as well as their wives Barbara and Laura, and other members of the Bush extended family, have quietly opposed Trump and his agenda.

The opposition to Trump has been based on many factors. A leading issue has been the belief that Trump and his campaign colluded with the Russians during the Presidential campaign of 2016, and there is widespread alarm at the “bromance” that seems clearly to exist between Trump and Vladimir Putin.

The danger to our national security, and the pro Russian leanings of so many Trump advisers and campaign staff, is against Republican tradition, which has strongly, been anti Russian since the rise of the Soviet Union a century ago, It still remains now with the Russian Federation.

Many in the GOP hold deeply suspicious views of Putin, a former officer in the KGB Secret Police.

Another major issue is that Trump has displayed antagonism and hostility toward the Republican Party leadership; an outsider, he basically ran against the party and its heritage and is openly hostile to the Republican establishment.


His reckless assault on manners and his disrespectful behavior toward John McCain, Paul Ryan, every Republican opponent in the 2016 Presidential race, and former Presidents and their aides, has antagonized members of the GOP power structure. The conviction has grown that Trump won’t listen to anyone, and that his bragging, egotistical, narcissistic, and misogynistic personality is undermining his presidency.

His lack of respect for tradition and for the reputation of the office he holds is extremely disconcerting to many who honor the history and heritage of the Presidency.

His failure to learn and his widespread ignorance alarms many. He has shown little interest in policy details and is seemingly only interested in winning. He has violated norms followed by Presidents of both parties and has undermined respect for the opposition and the media.

Rather than unite the country, he seems to relish polarizing it.

Trump’s horrible mistreatment of his staff and Cabinet has confounded the GOP.

Why go after your own Attorney General in public? He’s even joked about firing Health and Human Services Secretary Tom Price.

His constant need to be praised and honored by those who serve him, and to remind everyone of the fact that he is, in his own mind, the best President ever, except maybe for Abraham Lincoln, and that he should be on Mount Rushmore, antagonizes and exasperates many.

Trump loves pomp and circumstance too much, and is unable to control himself on Twitter, and has caused many conflicts with his wild accusations and taunting tweets. His behavior has caused many to wonder about his mental stability.

Millions fear that he could provoke a nuclear war or declare martial law if and when a terrible terrorist incident occurs on American soil.

The fact that Trump is a “loose cannon” unnerves the intelligence community, the diplomatic community, the government bureaucracy, and the international community.

While praising Putin he’s created uncertainty among our NATO and Asian allies. The fact that the news media assiduously is investigating and exposing wrongdoing has caused Trump to call them “fake media,” and to disparage the purpose of a free press in a democracy.

The proposal for a Mexico Wall and the crackdown on undocumented immigration, and the partial ban on Muslim immigration has caused great disarray, and has provoked growing incidents of hatred, prejudice, and discrimination.

His campaign type rallies stir up the one third of the nation which is his base, but suggests an affinity for fascism. His authoritarian bent makes those who wish to preserve our civil liberties and civil rights to be apprehensive.

His war on the environment alarms those who wish to maintain the gains made in the years since Theodore Roosevelt, and later Republican and Democratic Presidents, and the great advancements of the Environmental Protection Agency created under Richard Nixon in 1970.

The attacks on racial (African American and Latinos) and religious minorities (Muslims) in America, on women’s rights, and on the gay, lesbian and transgender community is now in full swing as well.

The social safety net created in the past one hundred years is fraying. There are many signs that Trump and his supporters want to repeal much of the 20th century’s social, economic, and political reforms under Presidents of both parties.

And of course there are his repeated assaults on the Justice Department, which have led many to conclude he’s guilty of obstruction of justice. Why else did he fire the FBI Director?

Trump seems to exist to create disarray, chaos, and anarchy, unlike any previous American President. We have never had an experience like this with any previous American President.

A case can be made that Trump has already committed multiple impeachable acts: colluding with Russia in 2016, obstructing justice, violating the Emoluments Clause, abusing his power through the use of far-reaching executive orders, not to mention evidence of blatant corruption on the part of those who are loyal to Trump and his vision, including family members.

The level of corruption already evident makes it possible that Trump’s administration will see a greater level of corruption than under Presidents Ulysses S. Grant, Warren G. Harding, and Richard Nixon.

While it is true that not all of the controversial actions of Donald Trump are opposed by all of the extensive list of individuals listed above, there are many who have a strong conviction that Trump is dangerous to constitutional order and to the promotion of honest government based on the rule of law.

It will take time for the ongoing investigation into the Trump Presidency to reach a stage where people will take action, but it seems assured that enough conservatives and some Republicans will join together with progressives and Democrats in recognition that Trump is dangerous and needs to be forced out of office by whatever legal means are available.

And for many of the list of critics above, the accession of Vice President Mike Pence would be seen as a plus, although not by progressives and Democrats. But the instability and uncertainty associated with Donald Trump is seen as likely to end under a Pence Presidency, even though it would be the most conservative Presidency since Calvin Coolidge, in many ways, to the right of Coolidge or Ronald Reagan, the other conservative favorite.

So for many Republicans and conservatives, they will have won the power to promote their agenda, but be much more able to predict their direction and goals than under the unpredictable Donald Trump. Expect the eventual abandonment of Trump by Republicans as the months go by into 2018.

A Pence Presidency is likely coming sooner rather than later, with the best situation for Republicans being to resolve the matter before the midterm Congressional elections next year.


Ronald L. Feinman is the author of Assassinations, Threats, and the American Presidency: From Andrew Jackson to Barack Obama (Rowman Littlefield Publishers, August 2015).




Edited by kyle585 (08/16/17 12:08 PM)

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