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#1497568 --- 04/08/17 09:36 AM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: Timbo]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32003
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: Timbo
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Forermac
I'm getting a royal laugh out of the fact that I receive a nice pension and comfortable lifestyle
Originally Posted By: Formermac
What insurance do you possess?

a business 'owner' with a comfortable lifestyle still relying on obamacare to pay for is healthcare needs... whistle

STILL don't have a clue how "Obamacare" works, do you? shocked



do tell how obamacare works for a supposedly 'successful' business owner?

one would think that he would not qualify for it

unless he ain't that 'successful' whistle
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#1497569 --- 04/08/17 09:37 AM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: Formermac]
Formermac Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 8060
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Be nice Timbo, like seeing a rerun for the 98th time, we know the outcome but it's always fun to watch the ending which is never pretty.





grin
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#1497579 --- 04/08/17 11:49 AM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: bluezone]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 12893
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Formermac
I'll get my licence

what is a 'licence'?

you got lice?

grin

... replies the guy incapable of using punctuation.
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#1497991 --- 04/20/17 03:30 AM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: Timbo]
kyle585 Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 13388
Loc: Somewhere out there
Sometimes I am forced to agree with George Will.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/...m=.c95287109fa3

Whatever replaces Obamacare will look a lot like Obamacare

Mend it, don’t end it” was President Bill Clinton’s rhetorical straddle regarding affirmative action. Republican efforts to “repeal and replace” the Affordable Care Act (Obamacare) look increasingly like “mend it, don’t end it.”

The problem is not that, as is frequently said, no entitlement can be ended. The most consequential legislation of the 1990s, the 1996 welfare reform, repealed a portion of the 1935 Social Security Act, which, through Aid to Families with Dependent Children, conferred a lifetime entitlement to welfare. Perhaps entitlements for the middle class are immortal. We shall see, as Social Security and Medicare as currently configured approach insolvency.

Meanwhile, Republicans who repeatedly voted to repeal the ACA — before voters gave them congressional majorities and a president who would sign a repeal — now must replace it. They must do so in conditions that have changed since, and partly because of, the ACA.

It is unknowable whether President Barack Obama produced an American consensus in favor of a government obligation to guarantee universal access to health insurance, or whether the debate surrounding the ACA merely catalyzed a gradually forming consensus. In any case, today’s debate about replacing the ACA is occurring in the context of that consensus. And in the context of several other new beliefs: Health insurance should not be denied because of an applicant’s preexisting medical conditions. And federal law should provide a refundable tax-credit entitlement and require that children up to age 26 be eligible for coverage under their parents’ insurance.

Furthermore, Republicans are insufficiently radical as they largely accept this third-party payer system that distorts decisions about recourse to the health-care system: About 180 million Americans are covered by employer-provided insurance, which is not taxed as what it obviously is — compensation. Republicans have abandoned a measure to treat as taxable income a small portion of the most generous employer-provided insurance plans, and have postponed for a nearly decade — meaning, probably, forever — the “Cadillac tax” on such plans.

Given all this, it is probable that whatever replaces the ACA’s tapestry of subsidies, regulations and mandates will be a tapestry of subsidies, regulations and mandates. The differences probably will constitute substantial improvements but will hardly constitute a revolution in the relation of the citizen, or the health-care sector, to the government.

Today, this sector is one-sixth of the American economy and larger than all but four national economies. It has been observed that if in 1900 America had had sophisticated national income statistics, the health-care sector would have been too negligible to notice: Most Americans then were born and died at home, and rudimentary medicine was mostly for making sick people as comfortable as possible while nature healed or killed them.

As a subject of political contention, medicine’s importance has risen rapidly with its competence. In 1900, 37 percent of American deaths were from infectious diseases; today 2 percent are. Medicine has advanced from the conquest of infectious diseases to the management of chronic ailments. And to the center of American politics.

Legislative bargaining often is additive: Supporters of legislation A endorse legislation B so that its advocates will reciprocate by supporting A. By this process a coalition (and government) grows. However, congressional bargaining about replacing/mending the ACA might become an exercise in subtraction. The debate is making clear that the expansion of a 52-year-old program, Medicaid, is the most important aspect of the seven-year-old ACA. Twenty Republican senators represent states that expanded Medicaid and face budget agonies if the expansion is abruptly reversed. But many Republican representatives and senators believe it should be. Perhaps this is a difference that can be split. If not, adding the support of some legislators will subtract that of others.

A religious skeptic in 19th-century England proposed carving three words over the portals of all the nation’s churches: “Important if true.” These words should be affixed to the Congressional Budget Office’s projections about how many more people would be uninsured in 2026 under House Speaker Paul D. Ryan’s replacement proposal (24 million) and the effect of it on the deficit (a $337 billion reduction over 10&#8201;years).

Conservatives warn against the fatal conceit of thinking that one can predict the consequences of comprehensive government interventions in complex systems. Now many Republicans say they know that the CBO is wrong and that they can structure incentives to accomplish more skillfully, and with less comprehensive health-care planning, what the ACA attempted. This confidence is important, whether or not it is true.
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#1497994 --- 04/20/17 07:39 AM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: bluezone]
cwjga Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/06/08
Posts: 9673
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Timbo
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Forermac
I'm getting a royal laugh out of the fact that I receive a nice pension and comfortable lifestyle
Originally Posted By: Formermac
What insurance do you possess?

a business 'owner' with a comfortable lifestyle still relying on obamacare to pay for is healthcare needs... whistle

STILL don't have a clue how "Obamacare" works, do you? shocked



do tell how obamacare works for a supposedly 'successful' business owner?

one would think that he would not qualify for it

unless he ain't that 'successful' whistle



He can't because it does not work.
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Annoying liberals, it's just too easy. Hard to believe how easy it is.

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#1497998 --- 04/20/17 08:19 AM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: cwjga]
kyle585 Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 13388
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: cwjga
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Timbo
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Forermac
I'm getting a royal laugh out of the fact that I receive a nice pension and comfortable lifestyle
Originally Posted By: Formermac
What insurance do you possess?
a business 'owner' with a comfortable lifestyle still relying on obamacare to pay for is healthcare needs... whistle
STILL don't have a clue how "Obamacare" works, do you? shocked
do tell how obamacare works for a supposedly 'successful' business owner? one would think that he would not qualify for it unless he ain't that 'successful' whistle
He can't because it does not work.
The Democrats agree to making changes. Even George Will says any Republican plan will be very similar. Polls show it is more popular than ever. Republicans who hold town halls are blasted nationwide for trying to get rid of it.
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#1498090 --- 04/24/17 07:07 PM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: kyle585]
kyle585 Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 13388
Loc: Somewhere out there
His health care plan? I didn't know he even had one! What a joke!

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/04/24/trump-healthcare-premiums-tweet-237530

President Donald Trump on Monday pledged that his yet-to-be-unveiled health care plan will cause premiums to “start tumbling down” and produce “real” health care.
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IF YOU STILL SUPPORT TRUMP AFTER ALL THIS, THEN YOU ARE REALLY MESSED UP!

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#1498799 --- 05/15/17 05:40 AM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: kyle585]
cwjga Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/06/08
Posts: 9673
Loc: NY
_________________________
Annoying liberals, it's just too easy. Hard to believe how easy it is.

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#1498805 --- 05/15/17 07:35 AM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: kyle585]
gassy one Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/27/16
Posts: 572
Yeah it's really good! LOL! It would have cost the country billions to bail it out when Obama said it would pay for itself and premiums were going to go down! What a joke!

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#1498819 --- 05/15/17 03:12 PM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: gassy one]
kyle585 Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 13388
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Yeah it's really good! LOL! It would have cost the country billions to bail it out when Obama said it would pay for itself and premiums were going to go down! What a joke!
George Will says: "Whatever replaces Obamacare will look a lot like Obamacare." I am not sure the premiums will not go down either as they take insurance away from 20 million people.
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IF YOU STILL SUPPORT TRUMP AFTER ALL THIS, THEN YOU ARE REALLY MESSED UP!

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#1498820 --- 05/15/17 03:14 PM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: gassy one]
kyle585 Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 13388
Loc: Somewhere out there
http://time.com/4771690/ahca-gop-health-care-bill-poll/

Poll: Just 31% of Americans Support the House GOP Health Care Bill
Katie Reilly
May 08, 2017

Less than a third of Americans support the GOP health care bill aimed at repealing the Affordable Care Act that passed the House last week, according to a new poll.
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IF YOU STILL SUPPORT TRUMP AFTER ALL THIS, THEN YOU ARE REALLY MESSED UP!

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#1498821 --- 05/15/17 03:42 PM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: kyle585]
cwjga Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/06/08
Posts: 9673
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Yeah it's really good! LOL! It would have cost the country billions to bail it out when Obama said it would pay for itself and premiums were going to go down! What a joke!
George Will says: "Whatever replaces Obamacare will look a lot like Obamacare." I am not sure the premiums will not go down either as they take insurance away from 20 million people.


They don't take insurance away from anyone, they give people back the right to choose for themselves. People are assuming because the government is not forcing them to have insurance that they will drop coverage.
Stop the fear mongering.
_________________________
Annoying liberals, it's just too easy. Hard to believe how easy it is.

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#1498827 --- 05/15/17 09:38 PM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: kyle585]
gassy one Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/27/16
Posts: 572
How many people actually know what's in it?

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#1498964 --- 05/18/17 07:22 AM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: cwjga]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32003
Loc: USA
thought there was a news report saying that aetna was dropping out of obamacare in 2018
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"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1498994 --- 05/18/17 12:36 PM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: cwjga]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 12893
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: cwjga
They don't take insurance away from anyone, they give people back the right to choose for themselves.

Oh, No. Don't even DARE to suggest such an abjectly false notion. Your public smack-down will be both biblical and epic.
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Everyone's entitled to their own opinions, but not their own facts.

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#1498995 --- 05/18/17 12:44 PM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: bluezone]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 12893
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: bluezone
thought there was a news report saying that aetna was dropping out of obamacare in 2018

Have you ever given even a moment's consideration as to WHY? No... of course you haven't.

Reading is FUNdamental:

Aetna dropped out of some Obamacare markets to help win its merger fight.

U.S. District Court Judge John D. Bates wrote that Aetna, pushing for a $37 billion merger with Humana since summer of 2015, decided to leave 17 counties in three states in order to improve the likelihood that the deal would be approved -- including one where the business was doing well. Florida was the company's third most-profitable exchange market in 2015 and the beginning of 2016.

“I just can’t make sense out of the Florida decision," Christopher Ciano, Aetna’s Florida market president wrote in an email quoted in the opinion. "Never thought we would pull the plug all together. [sic] Based on the latest run rate data ... we are making money from the on-exchange business."


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk...m=.7b26eae5b00e
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#1500123 --- 06/17/17 02:30 AM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: Timbo]
kyle585 Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 13388
Loc: Somewhere out there
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/demo...kushpmg00000009

A bipartisan group of governors has a message for Senate leaders about health care reform: Slow your roll.

Republican governors John Kasich of Ohio, Brian Sandoval of Nevada, and Charlie Baker of Massachusetts joined Democratic governors Steve Bullock of Montana, John Bel Edwards of Louisiana, John Hickenlooper of Colorado, and Tom Wolf of Pennsylvania in a letter Friday to Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) and Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.).

“We have watched with great interest the recent debate and House passage of H.R. 1628, the American Health Care Act,” the letter begins. “While we certainly agree that reforms need to be made to our nation’s health care system, as governors from both sides of the political aisle, we feel that true and lasting reforms are best approached by finding common ground in a bipartisan fashion.”

So far, that’s the direct opposite of how the Republican-led Congress has approached legislating on health care.
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IF YOU STILL SUPPORT TRUMP AFTER ALL THIS, THEN YOU ARE REALLY MESSED UP!

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#1500147 --- 06/17/17 09:50 PM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: kyle585]
gassy one Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/27/16
Posts: 572
Originally Posted By: kyle585
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/demo...kushpmg00000009

A bipartisan group of governors has a message for Senate leaders about health care reform: Slow your roll.

Republican governors John Kasich of Ohio, Brian Sandoval of Nevada, and Charlie Baker of Massachusetts joined Democratic governors Steve Bullock of Montana, John Bel Edwards of Louisiana, John Hickenlooper of Colorado, and Tom Wolf of Pennsylvania in a letter Friday to Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) and Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.).

“We have watched with great interest the recent debate and House passage of H.R. 1628, the American Health Care Act,” the letter begins. “While we certainly agree that reforms need to be made to our nation’s health care system, as governors from both sides of the political aisle, we feel that true and lasting reforms are best approached by finding common ground in a bipartisan fashion.”

So far, that’s the direct opposite of how the Republican-led Congress has approached legislating on health care.
I would rather they do nothing and let it go broke! LOL! One of Obamas great lies!

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#1500198 --- 06/19/17 08:55 AM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: gassy one]
gassy one Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/27/16
Posts: 572
Originally Posted By: gassy one
Originally Posted By: kyle585
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/demo...kushpmg00000009

A bipartisan group of governors has a message for Senate leaders about health care reform: Slow your roll.

Republican governors John Kasich of Ohio, Brian Sandoval of Nevada, and Charlie Baker of Massachusetts joined Democratic governors Steve Bullock of Montana, John Bel Edwards of Louisiana, John Hickenlooper of Colorado, and Tom Wolf of Pennsylvania in a letter Friday to Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) and Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer (D-N.Y.).

“We have watched with great interest the recent debate and House passage of H.R. 1628, the American Health Care Act,” the letter begins. “While we certainly agree that reforms need to be made to our nation’s health care system, as governors from both sides of the political aisle, we feel that true and lasting reforms are best approached by finding common ground in a bipartisan fashion.”

So far, that’s the direct opposite of how the Republican-led Congress has approached legislating on health care.
I would rather they do nothing and let it go broke! LOL! One of Obamas great lies!
You don't have any cut & pastes about how great the failed Obamacare is Kyle?

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#1500212 --- 06/19/17 12:14 PM Re: The Obamacare thread is getting too long [Re: gassy one]
kyle585 Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 13388
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: gassy one
You don't have any cut & pastes about how great the failed Obamacare is Kyle?
Since you don't read much, you don't know much. There are many cut and pastes about well it could work if the Republicans would work with the Dems on it instead of taking health insurance away from 23 million people.

http://thehill.com/blogs/congress-blog/h...mall-businesses

Don’t repeal the ACA: It’s working for small businesses
By Mike Brey - 01/10/17 12:10 PM EST

As federal lawmakers look to repeal the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (ACA) this month, a critical point is getting lost in all the partisan talk: The ACA is working, especially for small business owners.

Not long after I started Hobby Works in 1992, I began offering health coverage to my employees. That decision wasn’t just about attracting and retaining quality workers; as a former retail employee myself, I had found it difficult to get good, affordable insurance.

Although my business has been successful enough that I expanded over the years to four locations in the D.C. area and nearly 50 total employees (30 full-time equivalent employees), I found it increasingly difficult to offer health insurance to my workers. Prior to the ACA, we saw annual premium increases of 15-20 percent or more. As a result, we were forced to ask employees to pay more of their own premiums and face higher deductibles in order to continue offering them coverage.

The numbers make clear just how much my business and my employees benefited from the ACA: In the years prior to implementation, we experienced premium increases of 18-21 percent. Once the ACA’s provisions started going into effect however, our rates started improving; we experienced increases of only 7-8 percent.

Other small business owners struggled before the ACA, too. Small Business Majority’s scientific opinion polling found that of employers who didn’t offer health insurance to their employees, 70 percent said they didn’t provide it because they couldn’t afford it. What’s more, small businesses paid 18 percent more on average for health coverage than large companies and received fewer comprehensive benefits.

The Affordable Care Act was the first legislation in years to give me hope that this spiral of escalating costs and depreciating quality of coverage might finally end. Thanks to the healthcare law’s cost-containment provisions, our premiums have started to stabilize. What’s more, we now have more options when it comes to insurance carriers and health plans. Where we had only a few carriers to choose from in the past, we can now select between a variety of insurers that each offer many health plans, amounting to more than 100 options for my business to choose from.

While some claim that the healthcare law is a job killer and that small businesses are being forced to make their full-time employees cut their hours, I can say that this has not impacted my business at all. We don’t make expansion decisions based on tax law; we do this based on consumer confidence and how we expect sales to increase over time. We have never thought of expanding or shrinking based on the healthcare law’s requirements.

Given that there is a lot of talk right now about “repealing and replacing” the ACA, it’s important to consider that there are only a handful of options for a healthcare structure: we could go back to what we had before the ACA, which is not realistic; we could implement a single-payer system, which is unpopular; or we could continue with a private insurance-based hybrid system that is a form of the ACA.

As federal lawmakers look to repeal the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (ACA) this month, a critical point is getting lost in all the partisan talk: The ACA is working, especially for small business owners.

Not long after I started Hobby Works in 1992, I began offering health coverage to my employees. That decision wasn’t just about attracting and retaining quality workers; as a former retail employee myself, I had found it difficult to get good, affordable insurance.

Although my business has been successful enough that I expanded over the years to four locations in the D.C. area and nearly 50 total employees (30 full-time equivalent employees), I found it increasingly difficult to offer health insurance to my workers. Prior to the ACA, we saw annual premium increases of 15-20 percent or more. As a result, we were forced to ask employees to pay more of their own premiums and face higher deductibles in order to continue offering them coverage.

The numbers make clear just how much my business and my employees benefited from the ACA: In the years prior to implementation, we experienced premium increases of 18-21 percent. Once the ACA’s provisions started going into effect however, our rates started improving; we experienced increases of only 7-8 percent.

Other small business owners struggled before the ACA, too. Small Business Majority’s scientific opinion polling found that of employers who didn’t offer health insurance to their employees, 70 percent said they didn’t provide it because they couldn’t afford it. What’s more, small businesses paid 18 percent more on average for health coverage than large companies and received fewer comprehensive benefits.

The Affordable Care Act was the first legislation in years to give me hope that this spiral of escalating costs and depreciating quality of coverage might finally end. Thanks to the healthcare law’s cost-containment provisions, our premiums have started to stabilize. What’s more, we now have more options when it comes to insurance carriers and health plans. Where we had only a few carriers to choose from in the past, we can now select between a variety of insurers that each offer many health plans, amounting to more than 100 options for my business to choose from.

While some claim that the healthcare law is a job killer and that small businesses are being forced to make their full-time employees cut their hours, I can say that this has not impacted my business at all. We don’t make expansion decisions based on tax law; we do this based on consumer confidence and how we expect sales to increase over time. We have never thought of expanding or shrinking based on the healthcare law’s requirements.

Given that there is a lot of talk right now about “repealing and replacing” the ACA, it’s important to consider that there are only a handful of options for a healthcare structure: we could go back to what we had before the ACA, which is not realistic; we could implement a single-payer system, which is unpopular; or we could continue with a private insurance-based hybrid system that is a form of the ACA.

I’ll acknowledge that the ACA is not perfect. But instead of a full repeal, let’s expand on what is already working and make improvements where they are needed. After all, the ACA is the first meaningful reform in decades that meets many of small businesses’ core needs in regard to rising healthcare costs. To keep the economy growing, we need policies that allow us to spend less on health premiums so we can keep more of our own profits to reinvest in our companies and create jobs. Repealing a law that works will accomplish none of those things.

Mike Brey is president of Hobby Works and a member of Small Business Majority’s Small Business Council.
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