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#1444233 --- 04/11/14 05:37 AM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Rich_Tallcot]
VM Smith Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 11/29/05
Posts: 38160
Loc: Ship of Fools
And Dean's Cove, Taughannock, and Meyers' Point, and from the Canal and its launching spots. Ovid also has a public beach and ramp.

And the lake isn't public property; it's state property; they just let people use it, according to their rules. Fi, they'll close it any time they want to, and they have. They tax the private lakefront property owners as if those owners owned the lake, though. Cherokee Lake sounds nice. 59 miles long, with a year round federally maintained launch site, and cheap electricity from the 175' dam. smile
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#1444234 --- 04/11/14 06:34 AM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Rich_Tallcot]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 14706
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: Rich_Tallcot
Originally Posted By: Fritz
Originally Posted By: Timbo
Apparently you don't go on many job interviews with dark skin.

Neither do you! You're white as sheet, you have to get a spray tan to have a little color!
Apparently his ADHD has caused him to forget the photo he posted of himself in his Navy uniform.

That's beautiful thing about you clowns, is that all one has to do, is to sit back and watch you conjure your own ludicrous phantasms such as that one.

In the time that I've been posting on these forums, I have only twice alluded to my heritage, and my Navy pic was one of those times. Your own wild imaginations and gross assumptions give your phantasies a life of their own.

The fact that I pointed out Kyle's obvious racial insulation and/or lack of empathy, has no bearing on either my heritage or the issues at hand.

Still trying to see if flinging' yer poop'll eventually stick? Good luck with that. grin
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#1444235 --- 04/11/14 06:41 AM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Rich_Tallcot]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 14706
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: Rich_Tallcot
Originally Posted By: Formermac
You've just bought up a valid argument that many US residents have made for years, we initially gave sovereign nations the permission to build casinos on their property, churches and associates are tax exempted along with certain universities & colleges, hospitals, certain clubs such as the Knights of Columbus, schools, not for profit organizations....the list goes on. What no one anticipated was the amount of capital these casinos would generated but better yet, maybe you should question the motives of those who are the primary patrons(not Native Americans) in these casinos, smoke shops and gas stations generating millions.I find it hypocritical on all our part to vacillate on laws and regulations, depending on the impositions or advantages it creates for us. I grew up in the state of New York and have a recurring question.....how did man create laws that gave him permission to take public lakes(public property managed by the state), in this case the Finger lakes, sell lake front property to private individuals who in turn land lock the public lake to the extent that this lake has only 1 or 2 access points for the public to utilize the still public lake?
Tribes, which are quasi sovereign, not sovereign and not nations, built casinos before there was any control. IGRA was passed to put controls on them.

If tribes want to put up churches, hospitals, universities, or non-profit entities, they too will be tax exempt. It is called equality under the law.

One can access Cayuga Lake at Longpoint State Park, Aurora, Union Springs, Cayuga ,Mud Lock, Montezuma Refuge in Aurelius, Cayuga Lake State Park in Seneca Falls, Stewart Park in Ithaca plus several Marinas. Must be you never got out of Romulus much.

When did the European settlers and the State & US Governments ever engage in genocide, internment, relocation and re-eduction on churches, hospitals, universities, and non-profit entities?

I must have missed that history lesson.
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#1444236 --- 04/11/14 06:50 AM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Rich_Tallcot]
Timbo Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 07/18/12
Posts: 14706
Loc: CNY
Originally Posted By: Rich_Tallcot
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: Formermac
I own property in New York State Einstein.......I see that you have a attention span deficit.
I believe you said that you own property near Interlaken that your mother left you? Do you pay property and school tax on it? Since you are part Indian you would not have to pay and they could not foreclose on you.
Buzz - don't fall into the Timbo racist trap. It's not racial, it's political. If the properties were owned by individuals rather than purchased by the tribal government, they could be foreclosed on. No sovereign immunity defense by individuals.

No, it's BOTH. And much of the political end of things, has a strong racial component and constituency. They are, in essence, "laying down with dogs".
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#1444239 --- 04/11/14 09:14 AM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Formermac]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Now a question for you, one of my Seneca Fall buddies stated that he knew a guy on Ovid street that once flew a Confederate flag on his front porch. Based on some of your rhetoric and postings, would you happen to be just that fellow?......you fit the type.... you know.......ignorant, narrowed minded in regard to minorities and totally clueless. cool
OMG no. I am horrified that you would make such a suggestion. I believe in equality for all men. That is why I support the UCE and that is why I voted for President Obama. For fifty years now it has been illegal to discriminate based on race. That is what the so-called Cayuga Indian nation is doing now by buying whatever property they want willy-nilly USA, not paying taxes on it and calling it their nation. A total fiasco.

***********************************************************************************************************

Austin, Texas (CNN) Honoring the legacy of a former president he's barely mentioned previously, President Barack Obama on Thursday cast Lyndon B. Johnson's push to end legal segregation as a factor in his own ascension to the White House.

Obama joined three other living presidents in marking the 50th anniversary of the Civil Rights Act, and the movement that spurred its signing, at Johnson's presidential library in Austin.

The landmark measure, signed in 1964, made it illegal to discriminate based on race, outlawing for the first time segregation at lunch counters, buses, and other public spots.

"Because of the Civil Rights movement, because of the laws President Johnson signed, new doors of opportunity and education swung open for everybody," Obama said. "They swung open for you, and they swung open for me. And that's why I'm standing here today -- because of those efforts, because of that legacy."


Edited by kyle585 (04/11/14 11:17 AM)
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#1444240 --- 04/11/14 10:07 AM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Timbo]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: Timbo
When did the European settlers and the State & US Governments ever engage in genocide, internment, relocation and re-eduction on churches, hospitals, universities, and non-profit entities?

I must have missed that history lesson.
We all know the history. I keep asking what you think we should do now in 2014 to rectify the situation and I get no answer from you or anyone who believes as you do.
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#1444241 --- 04/11/14 10:11 AM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Timbo]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: Timbo
Originally Posted By: Rich_Tallcot
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: Formermac
I own property in New York State Einstein.......I see that you have a attention span deficit.
I believe you said that you own property near Interlaken that your mother left you? Do you pay property and school tax on it? Since you are part Indian you would not have to pay and they could not foreclose on you.
Buzz - don't fall into the Timbo racist trap. It's not racial, it's political. If the properties were owned by individuals rather than purchased by the tribal government, they could be foreclosed on. No sovereign immunity defense by individuals.
No, it's BOTH. And much of the political end of things, has a strong racial component and constituency.
In your mind only.
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#1444242 --- 04/11/14 11:42 AM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Rich_Tallcot]
Formermac Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 18884
Loc: Above ground
Originally Posted By: Rich_Tallcot
Originally Posted By: Formermac
You've stated that Seneca County gets monetary assistance to offset legal expenses from the state? Where does the state generate this money?


They get it from the tribal casinos.



I'll agree with that, which brings me to my premises of defending the Nation by reintegrating your incorrect postings time after time in regard to some implying that the Nation gives nothing back to the state. So can we assume that both casinos in Seneca Fall are inclusive to this regulation?

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#1444243 --- 04/11/14 11:49 AM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Formermac]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: Rich_Tallcot
Originally Posted By: Formermac
You've stated that Seneca County gets monetary assistance to offset legal expenses from the state? Where does the state generate this money?

They get it from the tribal casinos.

I'll agree with that, which brings me to my premises of defending the Nation by reintegrating your incorrect postings time after time in regard to some implying that the Nation gives nothing back to the state. So can we assume that both casinos in Seneca Fall are inclusive to this regulation?
Both? There are no casinos in Seneca Falls?
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#1444244 --- 04/11/14 11:55 AM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: kyle585]
Formermac Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 18884
Loc: Above ground
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: Formermac
A little local government economics 101, with the exception of NY sales taxes, the town, county and schools keeps their own money and are assisted by the State, who get it's money from NY State tax payers.....see the cycle there? wink
No. I do not know what you are driving at? How about state income tax? Entrance fees on state parks, hunting license fees, etc?


"STATE" Can't get anymore explicit than that, the state takes care of state's matters and those monies generated by each entity you've mention goes back to the state.
New York State reaps the benefits of State aide through, educational aide for our school, grants and capital projects such as Cornell University agriculture study expansions. I would like to interject one of the posting last night, stating that Nation's Casinos contribute to the state pot as well...Unless you beg to differ with one of your forum constituents. Now back to your original argument, it's never been ascertain if the Nation is obligated to pay county/town taxes. Implying it versus offering factual documents would be helpful in that regard.

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#1444245 --- 04/11/14 12:05 PM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: VM Smith]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: VM Smith
Quote:
show me where the Native American agree to pay taxes in the first place
It doesn't matter whether he agrees to or not. He's legally required to pay.
Bingo. American citizens owning property in America. On property where taxes have been paid since the sovereign nation of the United States of America was founded.
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#1444246 --- 04/11/14 12:05 PM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: kyle585]
Formermac Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 18884
Loc: Above ground
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: Rich_Tallcot
Originally Posted By: Formermac
You've stated that Seneca County gets monetary assistance to offset legal expenses from the state? Where does the state generate this money?

They get it from the tribal casinos.

I'll agree with that, which brings me to my premises of defending the Nation by reintegrating your incorrect postings time after time in regard to some implying that the Nation gives nothing back to the state. So can we assume that both casinos in Seneca Fall are inclusive to this regulation?
Both? There are no casinos in Seneca Falls?


I digress, one

The Cayuga Nation has two Class II Gaming facilities, both under the name of LakeSide Entertainment. One is located on Route 90 in Union Springs and the other on Route 89 in Seneca Falls. Both facilities are currently temporarily closed.

http://www.cayuganation-nsn.gov/About/Businesses/LakesideEntertainment

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#1444247 --- 04/11/14 12:07 PM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Formermac]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: Formermac
A little local government economics 101, with the exception of NY sales taxes, the town, county and schools keeps their own money and are assisted by the State, who get it's money from NY State tax payers.....see the cycle there? wink
No. I do not know what you are driving at? How about state income tax? Entrance fees on state parks, hunting license fees, etc?
"STATE" Can't get anymore explicit than that, the state takes care of state's matters and those monies generated by each entity you've mention goes back to the state. New York State reaps the benefits of State aide through, educational aide for our school, grants and capital projects such as Cornell University agriculture study expansions.
And the many state roads, etc. So what is your point?
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#1444248 --- 04/11/14 12:09 PM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: kyle585]
Formermac Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 18884
Loc: Above ground
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: VM Smith
Quote:
show me where the Native American agree to pay taxes in the first place
It doesn't matter whether he agrees to or not. He's legally required to pay.
Bingo. American citizens owning property in America. On property where taxes have been paid since the sovereign nation of the United States of America was founded.


Bingo, thanks for emphasizing that fact.
Does this imply that even American Whites/former slaves are taking the same stance as Native Americans

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereign_citizen_movement

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#1444249 --- 04/11/14 12:09 PM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Formermac]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: Rich_Tallcot
Originally Posted By: Formermac
You've stated that Seneca County gets monetary assistance to offset legal expenses from the state? Where does the state generate this money?
They get it from the tribal casinos.
I'll agree with that, which brings me to my premises of defending the Nation by reintegrating your incorrect postings time after time in regard to some implying that the Nation gives nothing back to the state. So can we assume that both casinos in Seneca Fall are inclusive to this regulation?
Both? There are no casinos in Seneca Falls?
I digress, one
The Cayuga Nation has two Class II Gaming facilities, both under the name of LakeSide Entertainment. One is located on Route 90 in Union Springs and the other on Route 89 in Seneca Falls. Both facilities are currently temporarily closed.http://www.cayuganation-nsn.gov/About/Businesses/LakesideEntertainment
Oh a closed gaming facilities. How cool.
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#1444250 --- 04/11/14 12:19 PM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: kyle585]
Formermac Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 18884
Loc: Above ground
Care to offer some info as to why, not debating here but curious since casinos normally do quite well.

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#1444251 --- 04/11/14 12:21 PM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Formermac]
Formermac Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 18884
Loc: Above ground
Maybe you knew this as well.
What's the current status of the Union Springs & Seneca Falls facilities?


http://auburnpub.com/news/local/updated-...4da2ec4bfb.html


http://www.fltimes.com/news/article_c320c2e8-6f0d-11e3-a040-001a4bcf887a.html

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#1444261 --- 04/11/14 01:28 PM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Formermac]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Care to offer some info as to why, not debating here but curious since casinos normally do quite well.
The more there are, the less well each will do. There has to be some limit to how much money people can waste on such a harmful addiction.


Edited by kyle585 (04/11/14 01:37 PM)
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#1444262 --- 04/11/14 01:29 PM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Formermac]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Maybe you knew this as well.
What's the current status of the Union Springs & Seneca Falls facilities?

http://auburnpub.com/news/local/updated-...4da2ec4bfb.html

http://www.fltimes.com/news/article_c320c2e8-6f0d-11e3-a040-001a4bcf887a.html
I haven't heard anything in a long time but I hope they never reopen.
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#1444264 --- 04/11/14 01:32 PM Re: Tribe not paying their fair share. [Re: Formermac]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: VM Smith
Quote:
show me where the Native American agree to pay taxes in the first place
It doesn't matter whether he agrees to or not. He's legally required to pay.
Bingo. American citizens owning property in America. On property where taxes have been paid since the sovereign nation of the United States of America was founded.
Bingo, thanks for emphasizing that fact.
Does this imply that even American Whites/former slaves are taking the same stance as Native Americans

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sovereign_citizen_movement
Maybe. Sooner or later they may destroy the best nation the world has ever known.
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