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#1458155 --- 08/30/14 07:42 AM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: Formermac]
sands Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/05/05
Posts: 8255
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: Formermac
It appears that 14 or so states took that right away from "the people"


Agreed. Or 21 states for people like Obama who think there are 57 states whistle
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#1458156 --- 08/30/14 07:49 AM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: sands]
Formermac Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 12390
Loc: Above ground
Originally Posted By: sands
Originally Posted By: Formermac
It appears that 14 or so states took that right away from "the people"


Agreed. Or 21 states for people like Obama who think there are 57 states whistle


You've somewhat chosen the "side track" tactics once again being that if all 50/(57) states had no restriction on gun laws, it doesn't negate the fact that you've failed in any response to answering how can any state violate the Constitution.

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#1458157 --- 08/30/14 07:55 AM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: Formermac]
Formermac Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 12390
Loc: Above ground
In your response if you really have any viability in that regard, tell us the distinction between you as a gun owner and anyone you've deem not capable in your mind to own a gun. Keep in mind, I with some hesitancy add someone you would consider a common street thug based not on fact but shear ignorance and false perceptions.

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#1458159 --- 08/30/14 08:01 AM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: Formermac]
sands Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/05/05
Posts: 8255
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: Formermac
how can any state violate the Constitution.

Quite simple. The same way the Federal government can, pass an unconstitutional law.
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#1458160 --- 08/30/14 08:13 AM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: sands]
Formermac Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 12390
Loc: Above ground
Originally Posted By: sands
Originally Posted By: Formermac
how can any state violate the Constitution.

Quite simple. The same way the Federal government can, pass an unconstitutional law.


Exactly, finally you've speak the truth, only you find this faction(gun control) not to your liking thus all the screed. Funny how other seek to disband laws deemed unfair toward them yet individual as yourself think those proposals to "unconstitutional" most recently your criticism of the ACA in it's attempt to make more people inclusive...BTW don't get into the cause and effects of that law because that simply derails this particular topic but keeping in mind the original premise and intention only. My premise if we are to uphold the Constitution, lets allow everyone the liberty to own a gun regardless. Entitlement seems to be the "Law of the land" for many individuals and they use the Constitution as a basis for substantiating that sometimes false perception.

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#1458161 --- 08/30/14 08:17 AM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: Formermac]
sands Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/05/05
Posts: 8255
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Funny how other seek to disband laws deemed unfair toward them yet individual as yourself think those proposals to "unconstitutional" most recently your criticism of the ACA


Funny how the U.S. District court declared Obamacare unconstitutional because it violates the Commerce Clause? Or how the U.S. Appeals court ruled the birth control mandate unconstitutional? You liberals have such short memories whistle
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#1458163 --- 08/30/14 08:25 AM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: sands]
Formermac Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 12390
Loc: Above ground
Originally Posted By: sands
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Funny how other seek to disband laws deemed unfair toward them yet individual as yourself think those proposals to "unconstitutional" most recently your criticism of the ACA


Funny how the U.S. District court declared Obamacare unconstitutional because it violates the Commerce Clause? Or how the U.S. Appeals court ruled the birth control mandate unconstitutional? You liberals have such short memories whistle


ROTFLMBO, Conservative/Liberal ..here we go again. How about simply put, you derailed the topic by getting off the topic of gun control, if you chose to debate birth control and the ACA, we can find that thread and proceed but for all practical purposes which I ask you not to do in my previous post yet you attempt to go there anyways, talk about the fact that the Constitution is possibly being violated in regard to states overriding it's "ORIGINAL" intent.


"The right to bear arms is the right to possess firearms granted by the United States Constitution .A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed"

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#1458166 --- 08/30/14 09:13 AM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: Formermac]
sands Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/05/05
Posts: 8255
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: Formermac
yet individual as yourself think those proposals to "unconstitutional" most recently your criticism of the ACA

you derailed the topic by getting off the topic of gun control, if you chose to debate birth control and the ACA,


Nope. Wasn't me whistle
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#1458167 --- 08/30/14 09:21 AM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: sands]
Formermac Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 12390
Loc: Above ground
Originally Posted By: sands
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Funny how other seek to disband laws deemed unfair toward them yet individual as yourself think those proposals to "unconstitutional" most recently your criticism of the ACA


Funny how the U.S. District court declared Obamacare unconstitutional because it violates the Commerce Clause? Or how the U.S. Appeals court ruled the birth control mandate unconstitutional? You liberals have such short memories whistle


Funny how a response including a tidbit of other laws causes one to totally talk exclusively on something entirely different now..... ROTFLMBO


"The right to bear arms is the right to possess firearms granted by the United States Constitution .A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed"



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#1458168 --- 08/30/14 09:47 AM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: Formermac]
Josephus Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 08/25/00
Posts: 11561
Loc: NYS
Originally Posted By: Formermac
"The right to bear arms is the right to possess firearms granted by the United States Constitution .A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed"

It does appear that the 2nd amendment does get violated in some cases. In many states, ex-cons are not allowed to posses firearms. But, if the 2nd amendment says that they have the right to keep and bear arms (a right... meaning that it can't be denied), why is this allowed? Don't get me wrong... I understand the reasons for it. I'm just looking at this from a purely legal stand point.
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#1458169 --- 08/30/14 10:02 AM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: Josephus]
Formermac Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 12390
Loc: Above ground
Agreed, I'm simply applying the same weapon of defense that Sands has over abused for months, why take the time to criticize and question the constitutionality of laws you disagree with yet in an contradictory manner, debate with fervor the Constitutional rights you now agree with but negate to rationalize that that very law is possibly unconstitutional as well.

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#1458176 --- 08/30/14 12:16 PM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: Formermac]
sands Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/05/05
Posts: 8255
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Agreed, I'm simply applying the same weapon of defense that Sands has over abused for months, why take the time to criticize and question the constitutionality of laws you disagree with yet in an contradictory manner, debate with fervor the Constitutional rights you now agree with but negate to rationalize that that very law is possibly unconstitutional as well.

An example of me "applying the same weapon of defense" that the right to bear arms is a Constitutional right "for months" laugh grin laugh grin

"INALIENABLE: incapable of being alienated, surrendered, or transferred. The right to self-defence is not "given" to us by the Constitution or any other document. It existed long before it was written and will exist long after it's gone. " - sands post# 1449515 - 06/03/14 09:11 PM
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#1458177 --- 08/30/14 12:41 PM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: sands]
Formermac Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 12390
Loc: Above ground
It can now be said that SANDS really is devoid of rationale or common sense. The Constitution was drafted in 1787(no opinion there) it contained amendments allowing citizens certain "INALIENABLE Rights, incapable of being alienated, surrendered, or transferred....now this is where Sands mental stability comes into question. Explain the fact that certain citizen CAN NOT legally carry or possess a handgun based not the Constitution but that said rights now being TRANSFERRED, ALIENATED and SURRENDERED by local and state laws. I suggest that you look up a few words for definition due to the fact that you gave the foundation for legally own a gun but failed in your comprehension that your info just confirming the basis of entitlement to only certain citizens. crazy laugh
In my line of expertise with electrical circuits, they call your premise "fuzzy logic" which can destroy, harm or kill if you fail to get all your facts and variables before proceeding. Thank you for the confirmation of not really having an concise response but must relegate yourself to spinning in circles and praying that will dazzle the crowd. Even observe a row boat with one paddle being used but on one side of the boat?.......you'll figure it out......then maybe not.ROTFLMBO

Post 1:42 PM #1458177 8/30/2014 by Formermac laugh laugh

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#1458180 --- 08/30/14 01:32 PM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: Formermac]
sands Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/05/05
Posts: 8255
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: Formermac
The Constitution was drafted in 1787(no opinion there) it contained amendments allowing citizens certain "INALIENABLE Rights,


My thoughts on gun control
"The right to self-defence is not "given" to us by the Constitution or any other document."
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#1458181 --- 08/30/14 01:43 PM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: sands]
Formermac Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 12390
Loc: Above ground
Originally Posted By: sands
Originally Posted By: Formermac
The Constitution was drafted in 1787(no opinion there) it contained amendments allowing citizens certain "INALIENABLE Rights,


My thoughts on gun control
"The right to self-defence is not "given" to us by the Constitution or any other document."


"Sound of buzzer" wrong again Sands

http://www.guncite.com/journals/senrpt/fgd-guar.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution


The Second amendment to the United States Constitution provides:


A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed.

The history of the Second Amendment indicates that its purposes were to secure to each individual the right to keep and bear arms so that he could protect his absolute individual rights as well as carry out his obligation to assist in the common defense. It is evident that the framers of the Constitution did not intend to limit the right to keep and bear arms to a formal military body or organized militia, but intended to provide for an "unorganized" armed citizenry prepared to assist in the common defense against a foreign invader or a domestic tyrant.




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#1458182 --- 08/30/14 02:17 PM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: Formermac]
Formermac Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 12390
Loc: Above ground
In all your self facilitation, you've failed in supply us reasoning as to why gun owners find it a self indulged entitlement and not for the general public. One reason and one reason only, the old adage of having their cake and eat it too mentality.....your rights to own an arsenal yet possessing the mindset of that somehow gun can be curtail/limited to the general population.

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#1458199 --- 08/30/14 07:06 PM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: Formermac]
sands Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/05/05
Posts: 8255
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: sands
My thoughts on gun control
"The right to self-defence is not "given" to us by the Constitution or any other document."

"Sound of buzzer" wrong again Sands

So those aren't my thoughts on gun control confused
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#1458201 --- 08/30/14 07:17 PM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: sands]
Formermac Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 12390
Loc: Above ground
Originally Posted By: sands
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: sands
My thoughts on gun control
"The right to self-defence is not "given" to us by the Constitution or any other document."

"Sound of buzzer" wrong again Sands

So those aren't my thoughts on gun control confused


"Cricket sound" One thing you've failed to recognize, your thoughts don't count here, they're only your personal opinions, discuss the Constitution, it's contents and how it relates to individual state gun laws. crazy crazy laugh
One more consideration, what prevents any person from adopting your attitude of "personal protection"...wait, they already have, thus rampant street crime & mass shootings with a plethora of guns to be had mostly from guess who? LOLOLOLOL... gun owners who purchased them accordingly to that state law.



http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/guns/procon/guns.html

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#1458215 --- 08/30/14 09:03 PM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: Formermac]
sands Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/05/05
Posts: 8255
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: sands
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: sands
My thoughts on gun control
"The right to self-defence is not "given" to us by the Constitution or any other document."
"Sound of buzzer" wrong again Sands
So those aren't my thoughts on gun control confused
your thoughts don't count here
So wait. Now they are my thoughts confused
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#1458216 --- 08/30/14 09:18 PM Re: My thoughts on gun control [Re: sands]
Formermac Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 10/22/12
Posts: 12390
Loc: Above ground
Originally Posted By: sands
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: sands
Originally Posted By: Formermac
Originally Posted By: sands
My thoughts on gun control
"The right to self-defence is not "given" to us by the Constitution or any other document."
"Sound of buzzer" wrong again Sands
So those aren't my thoughts on gun control confused
your thoughts don't count here
So wait. Now they are my thoughts :confused:


Going to bed, long day tomorrow...yes. They are your thoughts. Show us where you offered answers to my questions, never mind...your thoughts are your answer being that you have no facts nor citations.

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