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#1341735 - 04/30/12 12:20 PM
Ahahahahah...Wind Farms Cause Global Warming…
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Chicago Jesus
Senior Member
Registered: 01/16/12
Posts: 6143
Loc: Cocktails with Regie and Tiger
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Study Finds Wind Farms Cause Global Warming…
LONDON, April 29 (Reuters) – Large wind farms might have a warming effect on the local climate, research in the United States showed on Sunday, casting a shadow over the long-term sustainability of wind power.
Carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases from burning fossil fuels contribute to global warming, which could lead to the melting of glaciers, sea level rise, ocean acidification, crop failure and other devastating effects, scientists say.
In a move to cut such emissions, many nations are moving towards cleaner energy sources such as wind power.
The world’s wind farms last year had the capacity to produce 238 gigawatt of electricity at any one time. That was a 21 percent rise on 2010 and capacity is expected to reach nearly 500 gigawatt by the end of 2016 as more, and bigger, farms spring up, according to the Global Wind Energy Council.
Researchers at the State University of New York at Albany analysed the satellite data of areas around large wind farms in Texas, where four of the world’s largest farms are located, over the period 2003 to 2011.
The results, published in the journal Nature Climate Change, showed a warming trend of up to 0.72 degrees Celsius per decade in areas over the farms, compared with nearby regions without the farms.
“We attribute this warming primarily to wind farms,” the study said. The temperature change could be due to the effects of the energy expelled by farms and the movement and turbulence generated by turbine rotors, it said.
_________________________
Liberty anywhere is a threat to Collectivism everywhere.
Remember.... Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl
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#1341765 - 04/30/12 02:26 PM
Re: Ahahahahah...Wind Farms Cause Global Warming…
[Re: Chicago Jesus]
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VM Smith
Diamond Member
Registered: 11/28/05
Posts: 34294
Loc: Reality
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All generators produce heat:
"Continuous usage of the generator causes its various components to get heated up. It is essential to have a cooling and ventilation system to withdraw heat produced in the process.
Raw/fresh water is sometimes used as a coolant for generators, but these are mostly limited to specific situations like small generators in city applications or very large units over 2250 kW and above. Hydrogen is sometimes used as a coolant for the stator windings of large generator units since it is more efficient at absorbing heat than other coolants. Hydrogen removes heat from the generator and transfers it through a heat exchanger into a secondary cooling circuit that contains de-mineralized water as a coolant. This is why very large generators and small power plants often have large cooling towers next to them. For all other common applications, both residential and industrial, a standard radiator and fan is mounted on the generator and works as the primary cooling system."
The temperature change could be due to the effects of the energy expelled by farms and the movement and turbulence generated by turbine rotors, it said.
Could also be due the slowing of the wind due to the resistance of the blades causing a lowered heat redistribution, by wind, of the solar energy falling on that patch of ground. Changing wind patterns has got to effect climate, to the degree that wind generators are built and installed, for better or worse. Possibly it effects rainfall distribution, FI.
Any form of generation, and any form of heat, such as the average 100 watts put out by a human body, has effects on other things; nothing happens in isolation.
Many are under the illusion that wind power is free, or at least cheap, and with little effect on resources. Among many other things, they neglect the fossil energy and materials used to make the metal, carbon fiber, glass fiber, and plastic that goes into making them.
Nothing is free, and wind power is expensive, and in almost all cases, impractical, for that, and other, reasons. If it weren't, we'd all have wind generators at our homes, and it would have been done decades ago.
Government-pushed and backed wind power is mostly a program to help greens feel good about themselves, and a way to make it appear that government is out front, leading the charge to do something about a perceived "problem".
On the face of it, if you look at it simplistically, as most do, wind power is a great idea. If you consider all factors, it's not, at present, and maybe never will be, a good solution to pollution.
And it may be no solution to climate change, because it hasn't even been proven that CC is anthropogenic, and even if it is, how can you address CC change caused by people when there are 7B of them? To a large extent, it doesn't matter where people get their energy. Energy either causes heat, or is heat, and civilization not only requires energy, but energy use pretty much defines civilization. How do you square that circle? Some people are looking for a magical solution. There isn't one, although, for many, prayer fills that need.
People take resources out of the ground, and make money doing so. People envy those people, and so they must demonize them. To be fair, they should also demonize everybody, including themselves, who uses energy. Some greens are actually anti-human enough to make that leap.
_________________________
The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it.
John Hay (1872)
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#1341785 - 04/30/12 03:28 PM
Re: Ahahahahah...Wind Farms Cause Global Warming…
[Re: MeRightYouWrong]
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VM Smith
Diamond Member
Registered: 11/28/05
Posts: 34294
Loc: Reality
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I've remembered the question being asked, but had forgotten that P&T had asked it. I now think I remember that I read about it in Skeptical Inquirer.
Excellent vid. The green thing is more about feeling good, and less about thinking. Socialist twaddle.
Notice that when the one guy is informed of the real substance of the question, and when his hasty, ignorant, judgmental, superior attitude is laid bare, he just laughs it off? He'll soon be feeling good at yet another rally, no doubt: "Occupy Ignorance; Let Your Inner Scold Out!".
And, notice that in part of the vid, we see things that appear to be trees, but we still can't see a forest? Nice, apt allusion!
_________________________
The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it.
John Hay (1872)
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#1341795 - 04/30/12 04:46 PM
Re: Ahahahahah...Wind Farms Cause Global Warming…
[Re: MeRightYouWrong]
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PO'ed Moderate
Member
Registered: 02/26/12
Posts: 39
Loc: middle of the road and getting...
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http://youtu.be/3KTVW9bj6Bo
End the suffrage of women now!
All that proves is that people are stupid (if the majority of the people on here weren't proof enough.)
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#1341796 - 04/30/12 04:50 PM
Re: Ahahahahah...Wind Farms Cause Global Warming…
[Re: PO'ed Moderate]
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PO'ed Moderate
Member
Registered: 02/26/12
Posts: 39
Loc: middle of the road and getting...
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Back to the OP, Reuters is as bad as the AP NewsWire (which is where FoxNews and MSNBC get their "news" from). Leave the US if you want real news:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-17871300
Wind farms affect local weather
Richard Black By Richard Black Environment correspondent, BBC News
Wind farms can affect weather in their immediate locality, raising night-time temperatures on the ground, researchers working in Texas have shown.
They used satellite data to show that land around newly constructed wind farms warmed more than next-door areas.
The result - published in the journal Nature Climate Change - confirms an earlier, smaller study from 2010.
The scientists believe the effect is caused by turbines bringing relatively warm air down to ground level.
They suggest that turbines in other places might not produce the same value of ground temperature change.
The study area, in west-central Texas, saw a major turbine building programme in the middle of the last decade, with the number soaring from 111 in 2003 to 2325 just six years later.
Researchers used data from the Modis instruments on Nasa's Aqua and Terra satellites to measure ground temperatures across the study region and between the beginning and end of the construction boom, defined as as the difference between the average for 2003-5 and that for 2009-11.
The entire region saw a rise, but it was more pronounced around wind farms.
The researchers looked for other factors that could have affected the results, such as changes in vegetation, but found these were too small to produce the observed change.
Limited reach
The change was not identical across all of the wind farms. Having averaged the data, the researchers say the scale of the effect they saw is equivalent to a warming of about 0.72C per decade.
Recognising that this could wrongly be interpreted as suggesting the local temperature will continue to rise, lead researcher Liming Zhou cautioned: "The estimated warming trend only applies to the study region and to the study period, and thus should not be extrapolated linearly into other regions or over longer periods.
Wind turbine and wheat harvesting Could the local weather changes affect farming?
"For a given wind farm, the warming effect would likely reach a limit rather than continue to increase if no new wind turbines are added."
At night, air above ground level tends to be warmer than the ground. Dr Zhou and his colleagues believe the turbine blades are simply stirring up the air, mixing warm and cold, and bringing some of the warmth down to ground level.
"The result in the paper looks pretty solid to me," commented Prof Steven Sherwood from the Climate Change Research Centre at the University of New South Wales in Australia.
"Daytime temperatures do not appear to be affected. This makes sense, (and) this same strategy is commonly used by fruit growers who fly helicopters over their orchards to combat early morning frosts."
The 2010 study, also from the US, used data from a single location and computer modelling to show that wind turbines could produce local warming.
Dr Zhou, from the State University of New York in Albany, US, now plans to look across bigger scales and to decipher the mechanisms better.
"This article is a first step in exploring the potential of using satellite data to quantify the possible impacts of big wind farms on weather and climate," he told BBC News.
"We are now expanding this approach to other wind farms, and building models to understand the physical processes and mechanisms driving the interactions of wind turbines and the atmospheric boundary layer near the surface."
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#1341843 - 04/30/12 08:20 PM
Re: Ahahahahah...Wind Farms Cause Global Warming…
[Re: VM Smith]
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PO'ed Moderate
Member
Registered: 02/26/12
Posts: 39
Loc: middle of the road and getting...
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Better you than me. They're pretty, but can be noisy, and particularly objectionable to a crotchety geezer such as I. But no matter, and as long as as you got the green scare-email, and have taken it to heart, about carbon being a toxic pollutant to carbon-based life forms, such as humans and plants, then then you're well on your way to being a successful enviro-nut. Not knocking you; I'm just saying there are big government bucks in it, if you know how to play the handout game.
Wow, we're carbon-based lifeforms and mostly water. So if you all could just breathe carbon dioxide and hydrogen gas, you could live forever. Heck, if I remember high school chem, isn't sugar just carbon, hydrogen and oxygen? You just solve any future food crisis as well.
How has the Nobel prize people not awarded your genius yet?
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#1341946 - 05/01/12 02:06 PM
Re: Ahahahahah...Wind Farms Cause Global Warming…
[Re: PO'ed Moderate]
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VM Smith
Diamond Member
Registered: 11/28/05
Posts: 34294
Loc: Reality
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So if you all could just breathe carbon dioxide and hydrogen gas, you could live forever.
So you say. I'll have them my Nobel to you; you're obviously more deserving.
What I say is that more CO2 will make plants grow better, as it has many times in the past, and that one of the big problem of this world is and will be growing enough food to feed the large human population. We're talking about carbon, for Pete's sake; not radioactivity. In light of recent events, particularly, you might better focus your hysteria on that.
I personally think that most of the CO2 rise might well be from the natural climate warming driving the CO2 out of the seas into the atmosphere, and that many are thinking of the phenomenon backwards, and that yellow-flagging human progress, no matter how it satisfies most greens' "humans are a pox upon the earth" mentality, amounts to putting a band-aid on a fever.
Barking up a tree, IOW, when the tree isn't the problem, and when there is no problem that can be or even needs to be addressed.
How would you like your Nobel shipped? Mule train and sailing ship, no doubt.
_________________________
The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it.
John Hay (1872)
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