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#1289377 --- 07/31/11 07:21 AM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: brainman]
pixie Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/24/07
Posts: 1912
Loc: Romulus
there ae many types of solar and most will be a resonable payback, if you do some of the work your self . the cheapest best pay back is passive solar and even active air panels these are simple glass or plastic over black walls and roof with a air chamber between. hot water solar set up can payback in 7 to 8 years. electric with substies in ny for a grid tie system is 8-10 years if your carefull with instalation costs. but we must realize in the next few years electrical , oil , gas and other energys costs will only go up. and solar, wind technologys will go down in price . for the world to exist in the future we need to stop burning fuels, coal, oil and natural gas to make enegry, the heat, co2 exhaust and polution will do us in .
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#1289393 --- 07/31/11 09:35 AM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: pixie]
Harleybob5 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/15/11
Posts: 726
Loc: Wallonia Freedom Fighter
Originally Posted By: pixie
if i showed you the bill would you be a good little boy and go away
Ahahahahaha... right!
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#1289394 --- 07/31/11 09:42 AM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: pixie]
Harleybob5 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/15/11
Posts: 726
Loc: Wallonia Freedom Fighter
Originally Posted By: pixie
there ae many types of solar and most will be a resonable payback, if you do some of the work your self . the cheapest best pay back is passive solar and even active air panels these are simple glass or plastic over black walls and roof with a air chamber between. hot water solar set up can payback in 7 to 8 years. electric with substies in ny for a grid tie system is 8-10 years if your carefull with instalation costs. but we must realize in the next few years electrical , oil , gas and other energys costs will only go up. and solar, wind technologys will go down in price . for the world to exist in the future we need to stop burning fuels, coal, oil and natural gas to make enegry, the heat, co2 exhaust and polution will do us in .
All you do pixie is cut and paste google fantasy facts. You don't have a clue about solar energy, you're a phony!
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#1289437 --- 07/31/11 04:10 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: Harleybob5]
pixie Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/24/07
Posts: 1912
Loc: Romulus
Originally Posted By: Harleybob5
Originally Posted By: pixie
there ae many types of solar and most will be a resonable payback, if you do some of the work your self . the cheapest best pay back is passive solar and even active air panels these are simple glass or plastic over black walls and roof with a air chamber between. hot water solar set up can payback in 7 to 8 years. electric with substies in ny for a grid tie system is 8-10 years if your carefull with instalation costs. but we must realize in the next few years electrical , oil , gas and other energys costs will only go up. and solar, wind technologys will go down in price . for the world to exist in the future we need to stop burning fuels, coal, oil and natural gas to make enegry, the heat, co2 exhaust and polution will do us in .
All you do pixie is cut and paste google fantasy facts. You don't have a clue about solar energy, you're a phony!


so them why dont you enlighten us on how a solar grid feed system works and how the inverter is connected to prevent island resionant feedback . did not think you knew
your just mouthing off like normal/
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chemical / electrical engineer .

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#1289443 --- 07/31/11 05:32 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: pixie]
Harleybob5 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/15/11
Posts: 726
Loc: Wallonia Freedom Fighter
Originally Posted By: pixie
Originally Posted By: Harleybob5
Originally Posted By: pixie
there ae many types of solar and most will be a resonable payback, if you do some of the work your self . the cheapest best pay back is passive solar and even active air panels these are simple glass or plastic over black walls and roof with a air chamber between. hot water solar set up can payback in 7 to 8 years. electric with substies in ny for a grid tie system is 8-10 years if your carefull with instalation costs. but we must realize in the next few years electrical , oil , gas and other energys costs will only go up. and solar, wind technologys will go down in price . for the world to exist in the future we need to stop burning fuels, coal, oil and natural gas to make enegry, the heat, co2 exhaust and polution will do us in .
All you do pixie is cut and paste google fantasy facts. You don't have a clue about solar energy, you're a phony!


so them why dont you enlighten us on how a solar grid feed system works and how the inverter is connected to prevent island resionant feedback . did not think you knew
your just mouthing off like normal/
what ever you say crazy man!


Edited by Harleybob5 (07/31/11 05:34 PM)
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#1289457 --- 07/31/11 08:02 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: Harleybob5]
pixie Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/24/07
Posts: 1912
Loc: Romulus
you call me crazy yet you come on here make stupid stupid one liner comments and act like a kid . your only here cause you get your jollies insulting people on line becasue you dont have the guts to say to there face grow up .
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chemical / electrical engineer .

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#1289458 --- 07/31/11 08:14 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: pixie]
Harleybob5 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/15/11
Posts: 726
Loc: Wallonia Freedom Fighter
Originally Posted By: pixie
you call me crazy yet you come on here make stupid stupid one liner comments and act like a kid . your only here cause you get your jollies insulting people on line becasue you dont have the guts to say to there face grow up .
You aren't calling me out are you?
_________________________
Nuke em til they glow; then shoot em in the dark


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#1289691 --- 08/01/11 07:55 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: Harleybob5]
pixie Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/24/07
Posts: 1912
Loc: Romulus
if you dont like getting insults then dont give them out.
_________________________
chemical / electrical engineer .

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#1289701 --- 08/01/11 08:20 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: pixie]
Harleybob5 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/15/11
Posts: 726
Loc: Wallonia Freedom Fighter
Originally Posted By: pixie
if you dont like getting insults then dont give them out.
Ahahahahahaha
_________________________
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#1289742 --- 08/01/11 10:32 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: pixie]
brainman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/04/11
Posts: 715
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: pixie
there ae many types of solar and most will be a resonable payback, if you do some of the work your self . the cheapest best pay back is passive solar and even active air panels these are simple glass or plastic over black walls and roof with a air chamber between. hot water solar set up can payback in 7 to 8 years. electric with substies in ny for a grid tie system is 8-10 years if your carefull with instalation costs. but we must realize in the next few years electrical , oil , gas and other energys costs will only go up. and solar, wind technologys will go down in price . for the world to exist in the future we need to stop burning fuels, coal, oil and natural gas to make enegry, the heat, co2 exhaust and polution will do us in .




Without subsidies you're talking over a ten year payback right now which isn't very good. Ask anybody invoved in finance if a capital investment with over a ten year payback is good and they will laugh in your face.
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#1289804 --- 08/02/11 09:10 AM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: brainman]
looseleaf Offline
Member

Registered: 10/19/10
Posts: 85
Loc: Seneca Falls
From the WSJ:

"YOUNGSTOWN, Ohio—On the edge of the Mahoning River, where once stood dozens of blast furnaces, more than 400 workers are constructing what long has been considered unthinkable: a new $650 million steel plant.

When complete, it will stand 10 stories tall, occupy one million square feet and make a half million tons of seamless steel tubes used in "fracking" or drilling for natural gas in shale basins."

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#1289890 --- 08/02/11 03:55 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: brainman]
pixie Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/24/07
Posts: 1912
Loc: Romulus
belive it or not some people actualy care about the earth we live on and would still put up solar or reduce energy use just to feel good , and heck if its a 10 year payback all the better .
_________________________
chemical / electrical engineer .

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#1289928 --- 08/02/11 09:01 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: pixie]
brainman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/04/11
Posts: 715
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: pixie
belive it or not some people actualy care about the earth we live on and would still put up solar or reduce energy use just to feel good , and heck if its a 10 year payback all the better .



If you can afford it good for you. But don't try and tell us people that can't afford it that its economicly feasible when its not.
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your past will follow you forever

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#1290917 --- 08/07/11 05:53 AM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: brainman]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
To the Editor:

Congratulations to our superb Supervisor Daryl Jones and the Town of Jerusalem Hydrofracking Impact Study Committee for presenting a most informative forum called “Natural Gas Drilling — Issues and Impact: A Balanced Discussion” recently at Keuka College. The large attendance reflected the keen interest in the topic of natural gas drilling in our town and region.

My wife and I have been taxpayers in Jerusalem since 1977, and we have observed a variety of challenges to the environment and beauty of this special part of our world. The gypsy moth and zebra mussel problems pale in comparison to the industrialization and destructiveness that hydrofrack drilling will involve.

We are at a crossroads. We look forward to the Town Board’s ongoing and immediate action in protecting the health, welfare and safety of our residents and visitors rather than caving in to those who would sacrifice their lands and lifestyles to corporate and individual greed. Air and water contamination, scientifically validated by the forum panel to be the direct result of drilling, is not an acceptable trade-off for whatever temporary benefits may accrue to our town.

Greed as it impacts on the water we drink, the tranquility of our way of life and the quality of the air we breathe is not to be tolerated by our residents and those whom we have chosen to represent us on the various boards of decision makers in Jerusalem.

Industry representative Dr. Scott Cline’s remarks were most telling. When asked what impact the 24/7 drilling noise would have on life in Jerusalem, his response was essentially — “Well you’ll only have to put up with it for three years.”

Earlier in the evening he indicated that there will be major changes as a result of gas mining and hydrofrack drilling if it were to come to our area. His prediction that the industry has no interest in this region is countered by fact — on the very day of the forum, landowners were approached by energy company Chesapeake to sell their land for drilling purposes. The sky is falling, Dr. Cline, but only if we let it.

We join with the growing legion of people who stand tall and say that a complete ban of hydrofrack drilling in the Keuka Lake watershed is the only responsible and acceptable choice that can be made. Jerusalem’s leadership in making this possible is expected, supported by our involvement and is deeply appreciated.

PEGGY and JOSEPH HOFF
Keuka Park
(Hoff is a member of the Committee to Preserve The
Finger Lakes)


Edited by kyle585 (08/07/11 05:59 AM)
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#1290938 --- 08/07/11 07:26 AM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: kyle585]
brainman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/04/11
Posts: 715
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: kyle585
To the Editor:

Congratulations to our superb Supervisor Daryl Jones and the Town of Jerusalem Hydrofracking Impact Study Committee for presenting a most informative forum called “Natural Gas Drilling — Issues and Impact: A Balanced Discussion” recently at Keuka College. The large attendance reflected the keen interest in the topic of natural gas drilling in our town and region.

My wife and I have been taxpayers in Jerusalem since 1977, and we have observed a variety of challenges to the environment and beauty of this special part of our world. The gypsy moth and zebra mussel problems pale in comparison to the industrialization and destructiveness that hydrofrack drilling will involve.

We are at a crossroads. We look forward to the Town Board’s ongoing and immediate action in protecting the health, welfare and safety of our residents and visitors rather than caving in to those who would sacrifice their lands and lifestyles to corporate and individual greed. Air and water contamination, scientifically validated by the forum panel to be the direct result of drilling, is not an acceptable trade-off for whatever temporary benefits may accrue to our town.

Greed as it impacts on the water we drink, the tranquility of our way of life and the quality of the air we breathe is not to be tolerated by our residents and those whom we have chosen to represent us on the various boards of decision makers in Jerusalem.

Industry representative Dr. Scott Cline’s remarks were most telling. When asked what impact the 24/7 drilling noise would have on life in Jerusalem, his response was essentially — “Well you’ll only have to put up with it for three years.”

Earlier in the evening he indicated that there will be major changes as a result of gas mining and hydrofrack drilling if it were to come to our area. His prediction that the industry has no interest in this region is countered by fact — on the very day of the forum, landowners were approached by energy company Chesapeake to sell their land for drilling purposes. The sky is falling, Dr. Cline, but only if we let it.

We join with the growing legion of people who stand tall and say that a complete ban of hydrofrack drilling in the Keuka Lake watershed is the only responsible and acceptable choice that can be made. Jerusalem’s leadership in making this possible is expected, supported by our involvement and is deeply appreciated.

PEGGY and JOSEPH HOFF
Keuka Park
(Hoff is a member of the Committee to Preserve The
Finger Lakes)




They can pass all the bans they want it will never stand up in court. State and Feds supercede anything they pass. They're just grandstanding and being activist idiots like you Kyle.
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your past will follow you forever

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#1290947 --- 08/07/11 08:46 AM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: brainman]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: brainman
They can pass all the bans they want it will never stand up in court. State and Feds supercede anything they pass. They're just grandstanding and being activist idiots like you Kyle.
If every local town, city, and village government passes a ban against hydrofracking (as seems to be happening), the state will have a lot of angry people if they go against our wishes. I don't know if they want that.
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**** ATTENTION! BAD POLITICIANS ARE ELECTED BY GOOD PEOPLE WHO DON'T VOTE! ****

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#1291057 --- 08/07/11 07:13 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: kyle585]
brainman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/04/11
Posts: 715
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: brainman
They can pass all the bans they want it will never stand up in court. State and Feds supercede anything they pass. They're just grandstanding and being activist idiots like you Kyle.
If every local town, city, and village government passes a ban against hydrofracking (as seems to be happening), the state will have a lot of angry people if they go against our wishes. I don't know if they want that.



As usual you are on the minority side. Polls show 70% of NY are for drilling.
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your past will follow you forever

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#1291059 --- 08/07/11 07:24 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: brainman]
twocats Offline
Silver Member

Registered: 02/09/10
Posts: 11904
Loc: NYS
Says here it's an even split.

http://www.uticaod.com/latestnews/x1797066266/Poll-NYers-evenly-split-on-gas-drilling-rules

Poll: NYers evenly split on gas-drilling rules
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#1291063 --- 08/07/11 07:48 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: twocats]
VM Smith Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 11/28/05
Posts: 38160
Loc: Ship of Fools
Since the majority of the US and NY population is urban, it might be illuminating to take a poll of those actually residing in areas that will be affected by drilling.

I think that US gas is a better alternative to either coal or, at least with the prevailing technology, nuclear, and that it offers an alternative to imported oil.

I'm in favor of slowing it down and making sure regulation addresses at least some of the problems, such as making sure the waste water is adequately treated.
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#1291065 --- 08/07/11 08:00 PM Re: New Recommendations Issued in Hydraulic Fracturing [Re: brainman]
kyle585 Offline
Gold Member

Registered: 02/18/09
Posts: 19801
Loc: Somewhere out there
Originally Posted By: brainman
Originally Posted By: kyle585
Originally Posted By: brainman
They can pass all the bans they want it will never stand up in court. State and Feds supercede anything they pass. They're just grandstanding and being activist idiots like you Kyle.
If every local town, city, and village government passes a ban against hydrofracking (as seems to be happening), the state will have a lot of angry people if they go against our wishes. I don't know if they want that.

As usual you are on the minority side. Polls show 70% of NY are for drilling.
If 70% were in favor of drilling, how do you explain all these local governments passing bans?
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