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#1039651 --- 06/18/09 07:38 AM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: BJ Radford]
bluezone Offline
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Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: BJ Radford
Some of the Cayugas chose to go to Canada. Some chose to stay.


The ones that chose to stay where did they settle?
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#1039664 --- 06/18/09 07:48 AM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: bluezone]
BJ Radford Offline
Member

Registered: 03/30/09
Posts: 314
Loc: Geneva
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: BJ Radford
Some of the Cayugas chose to go to Canada. Some chose to stay.


The ones that chose to stay where did they settle?


Bluezone-
This is a one sided relationship between you and I. I'm not a fan of one sided relationships. I ask questions. You never answer them. You ask questions and I at least answer some of them. I get to the point where I can only stand so many posts full of rhetoric, smiley faces, and volume for the sake of volume.

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#1039676 --- 06/18/09 08:02 AM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: BJ Radford]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Thought that you only offered facts?
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#1039679 --- 06/18/09 08:04 AM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: bluezone]
BJ Radford Offline
Member

Registered: 03/30/09
Posts: 314
Loc: Geneva
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Thought that you only offered facts?


Refer to my last post - this one is only missing the smiley face.

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#1039682 --- 06/18/09 08:08 AM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: BJ Radford]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: BJ Radford


Refer to my last post - this one is only missing the smiley face.


Did they stay in NY or not?
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"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1039687 --- 06/18/09 08:10 AM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: bluezone]
BJ Radford Offline
Member

Registered: 03/30/09
Posts: 314
Loc: Geneva
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: BJ Radford


Refer to my last post - this one is only missing the smiley face.


Did they stay in NY or not?


How about that Sullivan question?

If you are asking if the Cayugas stayed in NY after the Sullivan campaign, the answer is yes.

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#1039690 --- 06/18/09 08:13 AM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: BJ Radford]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: BJ Radford
If you are asking if the Cayugas stayed in NY after the Sullivan campaign, the answer is yes.


Did they stay near Cayuga County?
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"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1039811 --- 06/18/09 01:37 PM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: BJ Radford]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: BJ Radford

How about that Sullivan question?

If you are asking if the Cayugas stayed in NY after the Sullivan campaign, the answer is yes.


Why are you not suing the British as your tribe sided with them and lost? The British gave you land in Canada. What no casino there?
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#1039851 --- 06/18/09 03:06 PM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: BJ Radford]
pixie Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/24/07
Posts: 1912
Loc: Romulus
According to 1900 census the only Cayuga Indians with the family name Halftown resided in ether Erie or just west of buffalo, its also interesting to note the family name Halftown has Russian connections , listing many with the last name Halftown in the Indian town in Erie as mixed Indian Russian descent. the 1900 census did not list any Cayuga Indians in the Seneca area.
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#1040230 --- 06/19/09 06:50 AM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: bluezone]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: BJ Radford
Some of the Cayugas chose to go to Canada. Some chose to stay.



If they chose to leave their land then did they expect NY to hold it forever until they returned?

Laches........
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#1040365 --- 06/19/09 11:43 AM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: bluezone]
SilverFox Offline
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Registered: 11/19/00
Posts: 6485
Loc: Waterloo
Of course they did because the 1794 Treaty of Canandaigua made it a federal reservation and guaranteed it to them forever - NOT!
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#1040597 --- 06/19/09 04:16 PM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: SilverFox]
bluezone Offline
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Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
That must be why they had to buy the land back and now want trust for which they did not sign up for with the IRA.
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#1040607 --- 06/19/09 04:33 PM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: bluezone]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Legal setback for Oneida Indian Nation Casino

y SIMON YIRKA-FOLSOM
Tue, Oct 11, 2005

Gazette staff writer

An appeal filed by the Oneida Indian Nation was rejected recently by the Appellate Division- Fourth Department of the State Supreme Court in Rochester, New York.

The appeal sought to overturn a trial court ruling which called into question the legality of the Oneida-operated Turning Stone Casino in Verona, Oneida County. The trial court ruled in favor of the Upstate Citizens for Equality, or UCE, an anti-gambling group based in Central New York. The ruling stated that the compact the Oneidas entered into in 1993 with former Gov. Mario Cuomo was illegal , because Cuomo did not have approval from the Legislature.

“Without a valid compact between New York and the Oneidas, the law says there can be no gambling, on or off reservation land,” said Cornelius D. Murray, the attorney representing UCE.

According to Murray, the Oneidas appealed the decision last year, arguing that they were not a party to the case, and therefore the trial court lacked jurisdiction, but the Appellate Division rejected the argument. Murray added that the U.S. Supreme Court ruling in City of Sherrill v. Oneida Indian Nation states that the land owned by the Oneidas is not actually “Indian land.” This means that the land is not exempt from federal and state law, which requires the tribe to pay taxes.

“If anybody tried to do what the Oneidas are doing, we’d get laughed into jail so fast it would make your head spin,” said Murray. “I don’t think anybody has the stomach to enforce the law.”



Seneca and Cayuga Counties should contact all other counties in the state and have them write in opposition to the trust for the Cayugas as the sales taxes lost will affect the entire state. If trust is granted in NY then all other tribes in NY state will want it.
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#1040923 --- 06/20/09 04:26 PM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: bluezone]
grinch Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/28/01
Posts: 4617
Loc: New York State
The simplest and a secure way to comment can be found at the url posted below.

It is easy to type in your name, address and comments. If you are strugging with how to phrase it, click on this url anyway and you will find areas that list the potential negative impacts on the environment, society, taxes etc. Just highlite, copy and paste into your message.

Take time to do it or be prepared for higher and higher taxes. As one retired banker said, granting trust status to a select group will be the final nail in the coffin of Seneca County.


http://www.nocayugalandintotrust.net/index.php/relevant-information/participate-now/comments

Send this information to your friends, family and associates asking for their assistance in showing a united, organized effort against this destructive policy.


Edited by grinch (06/20/09 04:32 PM)

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#1041361 --- 06/22/09 01:22 AM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: SilverFox]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: SilverFox
Of course they did because the 1794 Treaty of Canandaigua made it a federal reservation and guaranteed it to them forever - NOT!


The court has no choice but rule against the tribe as they would not put reservation land into trust.
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#1043179 --- 06/25/09 05:42 PM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: grinch]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Arguments in Oneida Indian land trust case focus on comma in 1983 federal law
by Glenn Coin / The Post-Standard
Wednesday June 24, 2009, 9:03 PM
The placement of a comma could mean the difference between the Oneida Indian Nation getting 13,000 acres of trust land or getting none at all.
Lawyers argued in court Wednesday in Albany about the significance of that comma in a 1983 federal law, and whether it meant the Oneidas were eligible for trust land.
Read one way, the placement of the comma says trust land can only go to tribes that already had trust land, and that would not include the Oneidas.
Read another way, the comma says that any tribe, including the Oneidas, could get trust land even if they didn't have any already.
It was one of many arcane and hotly contested points brought out in a 75-minute court hearing Wednesday. Lawyers for the state, the federal government, Madison and Oneida counties, and the Oneida nation appealed to U.S. District Court Judge Lawrence Kahn on matters as diverse as the legality of the Turning Stone casino and the meaning of a unanimous, 2005 U.S. Supreme Court decision.

The hearing involved three separate motions in a lawsuit brought by the state and Madison and Oneida counties against the federal government. The state and counties contend that the U.S. Department of Interior's decision in May 2008 to take 13,000 acres into trust for the Oneidas was unconstitutional.
Trust land is owned by the federal government but set aside for a tribe's use. The land is free from taxes and state and local control.
The crux of the issue is whether the federal government has the authority to take that land into trust. The state and counties say no, for a variety of reasons. One of those reasons, they argue, is that the Oneidas voted to opt out of the Indian Reorganization Act. That law gave the federal government the power to take land into trust for tribes. That law was adopted in 1934.
The Oneidas and the federal government argue, however, that a 1983 law, the Indian Land Consolidation Act, fixed that problem and made even those tribes who had originally opted out to be eligible for trust land.
That's where the comma problem comes in.
The key sentence in that 1983 law says that the government can take land into trust for any "Indian tribe, band, group, pueblo, or community, for which, or for the members of which, the United States holds lands in trust."
It's the comma after "community" that's at issue.

Does the placement of that comma mean that the restriction of already having land into trust applies only to an Indian "community," which the Oneidas were not? Or does it mean that the restriction of already having trust land applies to all of those categories, including "tribe?"
That's important because the federal government held no trust land for the Oneidas at the time. So it could, theoretically, mean the Oneidas aren't eligible for trust land.

Glenn Coin can be reached at or 470-3251.


-------------------------------------------



07-526 Carcieri v. Salazar (02/24/2009)

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/07-526.ZO.html


NCAI notes that the ILCA’s definition of “tribe” “means any Indian tribe, band, group, pueblo, or community for which, or for the members of which, the United States holds lands in trust.” 2201. But 2201 is, by its express terms, applicable only to Chapter 24 of Title 25 of the United States Code. Ibid. The IRA is codified in Chapter 14 of Title 25. See 465. Section 2201, therefore, does not itself alter the authority granted to the Secretary by 465.

---------------------------------

There is NO COMMA in the correct document

Trust to fail for the Oneidas and the Cayugas.


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#1044182 --- 06/27/09 10:46 AM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: bluezone]
bluezone Offline
Diamond Member

Registered: 12/19/04
Posts: 32556
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Arguments in Oneida Indian land trust case focus on comma in 1983 federal law


Why is the government even wasting the time for trust for the Oneidas as they have not paid their taxes on the properties.
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"OUR COUNTRY IS IN MOURNING, A SOLDIER DIED TODAY."

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#1044264 --- 06/27/09 03:42 PM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: bluezone]
pixie Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/24/07
Posts: 1912
Loc: Romulus
the Canadian goverment is so tired of tring to deal with the indian population at cornwall , as they keep closing a major bridge between USA nad Canada that they are building a new bridge which does not go through the reservation, as of today the bridge is still closed ( 30 days ) by local indian groups who have siezed the canadian custom buildings. Shows if you tick off a big enough country to often they find ways to get around the problem may cost 100 million but worth the trouble . This could happen here if the indians ever did close the 90 through way again .
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#1044319 --- 06/27/09 10:11 PM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: pixie]
Rich_Tallcot Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 5565
Loc: Greeneville, TN
Originally Posted By: pixie
I can see the casinos in Siberia now.
Actually, no you can not. Russia had about 1,200 casinos and they caused so much criminal activity, political bribes and social decay that Russia outlawed them and shut them all down.

There are about 1,800 casinos in the U.S.

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#1044324 --- 06/27/09 10:25 PM Re: Legislators mount land-trust opposition [Re: Santa_Cruzer]
Rich_Tallcot Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/19/03
Posts: 5565
Loc: Greeneville, TN
Originally Posted By: Santa_Cruzer
Originally Posted By: kyle585
As grinch says the Indians are paying them off.

"Indians are paying them off."

Then, of course you've ALREADY notified the attorney generals office of YOUR knowledge that New York State officials are accepting pay-offs from Native Nation(s)? Is that correct Kyle?

What was their response?
The Attorney General's response was that it is his job to defend and protect the Governor.

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