NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase.

Posted by: BraveHeart

NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 09:53 AM

Get this, they say partially due to the credit crunch they want a better than 9% increase. And you know what the PSC will give it to them.

BOHICA
Posted by: Senecamom

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 10:00 AM

Ha! bohica!!
Posted by: Z Genius Lusifer

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 10:01 AM

Just like EXCELLUS asks for 15% increases and they get them.....
Posted by: Senecamom

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 10:15 AM



PRESS RELEASE
NYSEG and RG&E Ask PSC for Prompt Action to Address Effects of Credit Crisis


ROCHESTER, N.Y., Jan 27, 2009 /PRNewswire via COMTEX/ -- Proposals Outline Important Investments in Infrastructure, Reliability, Growth, Low-Income Aid and Energy Efficiency
NYSEG and RG&E have filed rate requests asking the New York State Public Service Commission (PSC) for an increase in rates for electricity and natural gas delivery service.

The rate requests would ensure that the companies have sufficient cash flow for infrastructure investment and the continued provision of safe and reliable service.
The companies are forecasting a significant shortfall in cash needed to make required infrastructure investments. For NYSEG and RG&E these liquidity challenges have been intensified by the companies' "BBB" level credit ratings, which are the lowest bond ratings of any major electricity or natural gas utility in the state.

While considered "investment grade," in the current credit crisis these ratings have meant dramatically higher costs and periodically lower availability of essential capital.
Historically, the PSC has preferred having New York State utilities maintain "A" level credit ratings. NYSEG and RG&E share this goal, and have designed the rate requests in a manner that would begin moving the companies toward the achievement of an "A" level credit rating and a reduction in borrowing costs.


If approved, the rate requests would also provide for significant investment over a two-year period to improve reliability, enhance and accelerate energy efficiency programs, help low-income customers, increase renewable energy generation, stimulate regional economic growth, and ensure that safe and reliable service is not jeopardized.


The companies' investment plans call for:

-- Potentially investing more than $800 million in capital investment to improve reliability, expand infrastructure and increase the generation of renewable hydropower.

These investments would significantly boost regional economic development and move New York closer to Governor David Paterson's goal of having New York meet 45% of its electricity needs through improved energy efficiency and clean renewable energy.


-- Increasing by more than $20 million the operating companies' support for aid to low-income customers, a need that is burgeoning in the current economic decline.


-- Developing enhanced energy efficiency programs with a goal of reducing customer bills through less energy consumption.


-- Committing $50 million annually to continue the environmental clean-up of manufactured gas plant and other sites in cooperation with the state Department of Environmental Conservation (DEC).


-- Improving reliability by implementing an enhanced vegetation management program.


The increase in the average NYSEG residential electricity bill would be approximately $8.80 per month (9.9%) and the average NYSEG residential natural gas bill would increase approximately $12.20 per month (8.8%). The increase in the average RG&E residential electricity bill would be approximately $8.80 per month (11.9%) and the average RG&E residential natural gas bill would increase approximately $7.88 per month (7.4%).


NYSEG and RG&E's electricity delivery rates have not increased since 1996, and have been decreased twice since then. Natural gas delivery rates have been essentially flat since 1994.

NYSEG and RG&E have asked the PSC to consider and approve the requests by July 1 in recognition of the significant financial harm caused by the global credit crisis and the fact that the utilities face a significant cash shortage due to an increase in uncollectible bills, reduced sales due to a decrease in economic activity, property taxes that have long been among the nation's highest, and other steadily increasing business costs such as pensions and health care.

Collectively, these factors are undermining NYSEG and RG&E's ability to fund infrastructure investments needed to keep service safe and reliable.

About NYSEG and RG&E: NYSEG and RG&E are subsidiaries of Energy East Corporation, a super-regional energy services and delivery company in the Northeast. NYSEG serves 872,000 electricity customers and 256,000 natural gas customers across more than 40% of upstate New York. RG&E serves 360,000 electricity customers and 297,000 natural gas customers in a nine-county region centered on the City of Rochester.

By providing outstanding customer service and meeting customers' energy requirements in an environmentally-responsible manner, NYSEG and RG&E will continue to be valuable assets to the communities they serve.



For more information, visit nyseg.com and rge.com.
SOURCE NYSEG; RG&E
http://www.nyseg.com
Posted by: antnee

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 10:35 AM

Time to move the hell out of New York!
Posted by: SFisWonderful

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 06:03 PM

Ohhh. . .I love helping the "low income" customers! Maybe they need more? What more can I do? Do your kids need clothes? How is your car running? Do you want a new one?

How 'bout this. . .get A job or a SECOND job or cut your weed and/or alcohol habit! ! !
Posted by: Yetta Nother

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 06:05 PM

NYSEG makes me sick! As if people aren't starving already. The Electric Mafia hard at work.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 06:11 PM

Natural gas trading near $4.476 down from over $14.
When will the customers see their natural gas rates drop the same percentage?




NGG09.NYM Natural Gas Feb 09 4.476 2:55PM ET 0.027 (0.60%)
NGH09.NYM Natural Gas Mar 09 4.431 6:12PM ET 0.011 (0.25%)
NGJ09.NYM Natural Gas Apr 09 4.491 5:45PM ET 0.015 (0.33%)
NGK09.NYM Natural Gas May 09 4.566 5:45PM ET 0.017 (0.37%)
NGM09.NYM Natural Gas Jun 09 4.669 5:45PM ET 0.017 (0.36%)
NGN09.NYM Natural Gas Jul 09 4.794 5:45PM ET 0.017 (0.35%)
NGQ09.NYM Natural Gas Aug 09 4.891 2:50PM ET 0.016 (0.33%)
NGU09.NYM Natural Gas Sep 09 4.949 5:45PM ET 0.015 (0.30%)
NGV09.NYM Natural Gas Oct 09 5.076 5:45PM ET 0.015 (0.29%)
NGX09.NYM Natural Gas Nov 09 5.661 5:45PM ET 0.025 (0.44%)
NGZ09.NYM Natural Gas Dec 09 6.291 5:45PM ET 0.025 (0.40%)
Posted by: BraveHeart

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 06:24 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Natural gas trading near $4.476 down from over $14.
When will the customers see their natural gas rates drop the same percentage?




NGG09.NYM Natural Gas Feb 09 4.476 2:55PM ET 0.027 (0.60%)
NGH09.NYM Natural Gas Mar 09 4.431 6:12PM ET 0.011 (0.25%)
NGJ09.NYM Natural Gas Apr 09 4.491 5:45PM ET 0.015 (0.33%)
NGK09.NYM Natural Gas May 09 4.566 5:45PM ET 0.017 (0.37%)
NGM09.NYM Natural Gas Jun 09 4.669 5:45PM ET 0.017 (0.36%)
NGN09.NYM Natural Gas Jul 09 4.794 5:45PM ET 0.017 (0.35%)
NGQ09.NYM Natural Gas Aug 09 4.891 2:50PM ET 0.016 (0.33%)
NGU09.NYM Natural Gas Sep 09 4.949 5:45PM ET 0.015 (0.30%)
NGV09.NYM Natural Gas Oct 09 5.076 5:45PM ET 0.015 (0.29%)
NGX09.NYM Natural Gas Nov 09 5.661 5:45PM ET 0.025 (0.44%)
NGZ09.NYM Natural Gas Dec 09 6.291 5:45PM ET 0.025 (0.40%)


You wont
Posted by: BraveHeart

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 06:24 PM

Complain to the PSC
Posted by: BraveHeart

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 06:25 PM

web_questions@dps.state.ny.us
Posted by: BraveHeart

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 06:37 PM

To Whom it may concern.

1) Why do you request input on your web site for the Con-Ed rate increase but not the NYSEG one ?

2) Please do not grant NYSEG the 9.9 rate increase they want. Gas is trading significantly lower than it has been 14$ down to 4 $. This rate increase will put an undue burden on the already over taxed,under paid citizens of central new York.

We do not get 9.9 percent raises, we can not keep taking on greater and greater costs from the utilities.

This state is hemmoraging taxpayers as it is. These kind of increases along with Patterson's new fees and taxes will only drive more out of this state.

Please help us and stop this madness.
Posted by: jojotaxpayer

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/28/09 07:16 PM

CROOKS! Thieves!

WT@#$% anyways?
Posted by: sassyone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 07:14 AM

This is liable to tip enough people over the edge between being able to "just" pay their bills, to being among the group asking for HEAP. Maybe if more and more people asked for HEAP they would understand. Ok, probably not.
Posted by: Sweetcakes

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 07:19 AM

Are dinners still part of the package for the lineman?
Posted by: threeputt

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 07:23 AM

Originally Posted By: antnee
Time to move the hell out of New York!


I wish I had a dime for every time someone says that!
Posted by: sassyone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 07:30 AM

Sweetcakes, I'm sorry I don't know anything about dinners for linemen. Not sure what you are talking about.
Posted by: Sweetcakes

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 07:44 AM

Years ago after they went out on a emergency they'd go out to dinner..
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 09:25 AM

Originally Posted By: Sweetcakes
Are dinners still part of the package for the lineman?



Yes. We are not just talking about the linemen getting a luch break, they get to go to a restaurant and have a meal. NYSEG has accounts at several restaurants around.

Let's not forget that NYSEG and RG&E are one in the same company and they are both asking for rate increases.
Posted by: trump

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 09:44 AM

In the Hometown Review this morning:

"Despite the high cost of living, it remains popular."
Posted by: Sweetcakes

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 10:36 AM

Wonder how many other employer do this?

Any one for steak?
Posted by: BraveHeart

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 10:46 AM

I buy my employees lunch if they meet certain goals.

The Company buys lunch if we have to work on projects after hours sometimes.

Yesterday they bought lunch Pizza for the ones that made it in.
Posted by: Sweetcakes

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 10:47 AM

What no steaks?
Posted by: BraveHeart

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 11:27 AM

No steaks ;o(
Posted by: jojotaxpayer

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 04:35 PM

Whatever, NYSEG still rips us off and we have no other choice.

As does TWC, GAS and OIL companies, TAXING entities.

Just bend over and let them drive a truck up your @$%!
Posted by: Z Genius Lusifer

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/29/09 08:00 PM

sideways
Posted by: magoo

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/30/09 07:25 AM

PSC
Does anyone know how to contact them to argue against this raise?
Posted by: Senecamom

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/30/09 08:54 AM

Originally Posted By: magoo
PSC
Does anyone know how to contact them to argue against this raise?

http://www.dps.state.ny.us/
Posted by: magoo

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/31/09 05:43 AM

Thank you senecamom,I will send a e-mail
Posted by: Hugh

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/31/09 05:55 AM

im sure they will listen
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/01/09 08:13 AM

I thought that Iberdrola had to have a price cap for 18 months as a conditon of buying NYSEG?
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/02/09 06:46 PM

Originally Posted By: senecamom
The increase in the average NYSEG residential electricity bill would be approximately $8.80 per month (9.9%) and the average NYSEG residential natural gas bill would increase approximately $12.20 per month (8.8%). The increase in the average RG&E residential electricity bill would be approximately $8.80 per month (11.9%) and the average RG&E residential natural gas bill would increase approximately $7.88 per month (7.4%).


Are these basic service charge rate increases or increases to the electric and gas usage?

Does Penn Yan and Fairport not have their own public electric that is far less for their customers?
Posted by: Senecamom

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/02/09 06:59 PM

All this information is from the Press Release. Didn't it say somewhere that the affects wouldn't be realized until June or July?....

I beleive that as with any corporation its the ones in charge (ivory towers) that are robbing all of us. Check out the CEO's and see what they are taking in pay and bonuses and more importantly pensions equated to years worked.....
Posted by: oops12

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/02/09 09:27 PM

Robbing us... Absoluetly, my gosh, first Time Warner with their new rate hikes, now, NYSEG. Come on, like it was posted, I agree with Braveheart on this one. Pizza & wings, under circumstances, sure. Where's my boss? I want craplegs with the rest of the union.

And the transportation to get us there.
Posted by: justaxme

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 04:52 AM

NYSEG is a monopoly that couldn't care less about it's customers. The only thing you can do is cut back as much as possible to offset these undeserved rate increases.
Posted by: VM Smith

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 04:56 AM

"I want craplegs with the rest of the union."

I'll pass on those.
Posted by: Della

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 04:59 AM

HA!
Posted by: VM Smith

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 05:01 AM

How are you feeling today?
Posted by: magoo

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 06:19 AM

I called 202-224-4451 talked with a staffer of Senator Gillibrand and requested she stand up for the people of upstate ny and say no to this requested raise. I also sent a e-mail to State Senator Michael Nozzolio,requesting the same from him.
Posted by: VM Smith

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 06:21 AM

Good move; it can't hurt, but I'm not optimistic.
Posted by: Under Dog

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 08:10 AM

The facts escape me but did SF have the opportunity to own/use the hydroelectric station down by the locks. I believe the property and rights were ultimately sold.

My understanding was it could provide all the necessary power required to light up the community.

Was this another fine example of poor decision making on the part of our leaders???

I'm sure someone can fill in the details. Thanks.
Posted by: Z Genius Lusifer

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 09:21 AM

Tony C wanted to buy it when it was for sale during his tenure. He could not get support from Diana Smith at the time whose ward the power plant is located in.
Posted by: Estelle

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 12:26 PM

Will they give us reliable service
for this increase?

Have they fixed the problems
that put entire areas in a blackout
if there's a thunderstorm, blizzard
or a tree falls in Brooklyn?
THAT might make 9% worth it.

But in this recession/depression,
it is inconscionable for them
to even think about doing this.
Posted by: grinch

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 02:56 PM

I just received my Gas and Electric bill for the past month. I am not on a budget.

The way they manipulate the prices, add fees of all sorts, they do not have to worry about getting a 9% increase.

If the weather is warm, they add a factor, if it is 11 degs colder as it was this year they adjust at a price below what they add when the weather is warmer.

The cost of natl gas has been down, yet the market rate charged is higher than what they are offering as a fixed rate. So strike that option. If you question them, their response will be they bought when the price was higher so they have to recoup the cost.

To sum it up my cost was 31% higher this month than the corresponding month last year.
Posted by: VM Smith

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 03:08 PM

"Was this another fine example of poor decision making on the part of our leaders???"

Yes. Having the blessing of an already built resource like that on your doorstep, and available on the market, and then passing it up, is sufficient reason for those who opposed it never to be trusted with any elected office, IMO.

Look at the bright side, though; you've probably got the nicest dog poop stations in the area!
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 03:16 PM

Originally Posted By: grinch
... If you question them, their response will be they bought when the price was higher so they have to recoup the cost.



They said the opposite when I questioned them about the price spike right after hurricane Katrina. I asked them if they lock in the price during the summer to control costs but they said that they cannot do that.
Posted by: snowbird99

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/03/09 06:19 PM

You think you have problems in NY? I spend the winter months in Florida. Two of the major utility companies down here have requested a 25 percent rate increase. Needless to say, people are screaming mad.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/04/09 02:53 PM

How much do they charge per kilowatt in Florida? ($0.05, $0.10, $0.15...)
What was the reason given for the 25% increase?
Posted by: snowbird99

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/04/09 04:30 PM

With the new increase the price is $.137 per kwh. Reasons given for the increase are fuel costs, new construction of a nuclear powered plant and installation of clean-air technology to an existing coal fired plant.
Posted by: jojotaxpayer

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/05/09 06:50 AM

Florida could get hurt by that, as they rely heavily on air conditioning which costs $$$$.

Too bad all of the utility companies feel the need to take advantage of us. The FTC feels the need to let them repeatedly do it.
Posted by: codyboy

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/05/09 07:10 AM

If one opts for fixed billing, can they still raise the rates on you?
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/05/09 08:20 AM

If one selects another supplier than will this charge still be on the bill?
Posted by: Senecamom

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/05/09 09:48 AM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
If one selects another supplier than will this charge still be on the bill?


http://www.energyguide.com/finder/showof...OilOfferCount=0

check this site for comparisons available in your zip code.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/06/09 07:48 AM

Originally Posted By: snowbird99
With the new increase the price is $.137 per kwh. Reasons given for the increase are fuel costs, new construction of a nuclear powered plant and installation of clean-air technology to an existing coal fired plant.



We pay about $.075 per kwh with a variable rate. The fixed rate is around $.11 per kwh. Your utility bill should still be considerable lower than compared to us up north as we have to heat the homes for half of the year. The cost of coal, natural gas... has dropped a considerable amount and I do not see how the utilities can claim that the prices have increased for them. Even the price of gasoline has come down thereby helping to save the utilities money with their fleet operations.


Time to put up our own personal wind turbines in the back yard.


http://www.wifi-parts.com/seahawk.html


.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/11/09 09:05 AM

I just checked Penn Yan and Fairports websites to see what they charge for electricity and the rates are about 4 times LESS than NYSEG. Why would that be?


------------------------------------------

Village of Penn Yan Services

Electric Rates
Residential (per meter, per month)

Energy Charge (per KWH)

April - November $0.0297

December - March (first 1250 KWH) $0.0297

December - March (over 1250 KWH) $ 0.05590

----------------------------------


Village of Fairport


Residential – S.C. 1

Customer Charge (per month) $ 4.00
Energy Charge, per kwh
April 1 to Nov 31 and first 1000 kwh (all months) $ .035
Winter (Dec 1 to March 31) usage over 1000 kwh $ .0525



Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/11/09 08:35 PM

This really burns me. Last September my electric bill better that tripled in usage. I called NYSEG and asked if they would check my meter.They said my meter was fine and to pay my bill. The following month it again ran high in usage and again i called and was told to pay my bill. I normally use appr. 1,300 kwh per month. The highest bill was for 4,865 kwh for 1 month. The following bill was for 2,500 kwh. So i decided to call the PSC. lord behold the next day NYSEG called and said they would check the meter. Finally i thought after more than 2 months.The meter techs came down. After playing with their equipment for about half hour they got it to work. Sir your meter just checked at 101% accurate. This was on Friday appr. 1400 hrs. I also allowed NYSEG to go through my house and even they said no way could you use that much power. At 1600 hrs my meter stoped registering. Yea i'm getting free electric as it was on in the house but not registering. So i called NYSEG right away and reported a stuck meter. They finally showed up on monday by that time the meter was running again. Oh did i mention i live just 2 blocks from the NYSEG ofiice and watch their vehicles pass every day. I had been documenting meter readings for some time.

So they said everything is fine it is working again. Still complaining how can a meter be accurate when it stoped working for appr. 20 hrs. I called the PSC back and was told NYSEG reported to them i was satisfied with the meter check and the matter had been resolved. So i told PSC no way was that ever said.

I told the PSC even NYSEG could not justify that much power usage so here we go again. PSC steps up the investigation and here comes NYSEG again. This time with 4 employees to go through my house again. And again they could not justify the power usage and NYSEG completed an estimate of how much power i could draw with what appliances were in the house. Their estimate was conducted if i ran my furnace and all my air cond. and if my sump pump was all to run 24 / 7 i could use a maximum of 1,662 kwh per month. Not even close to what they were billing me. So NYSEG installed a second meter to run inline with the old one. Because they ran it for a couple weeks and no drastic differance between the two registered they reported to the PSC the old meter was fine and that they conducted an estimated usage of electric and it was inline with my bill.

So when i recieved the letter from the PSC stating this again i called. I offered to send them a copy of the estimated usage NYSEG conducted and they were NOT inline. So this makes the second time NYSEG was caught lieing to the PSC. This time i'm upset and asked the PSC why were they allowing NYSEG to get away with filing false reports to them Of course no answer. So i asked who over sees the PSC and i was told the Governors office was over them You got it i sat down and e-mailed the governors office. That was just done today.

When NYSEG was in the house i asked. What was NYSEG'S cost for a new electric meter as this one was appr. 30 years old and they had already refused my request for a new meter. The tech said appr. $25.00 for a new meter is what NYSEG pays. I reached in my pocket and pulled out $25.00 and offered to pay for a new meter. I was told by the supervisor she would have to get permission from corporate. I later rec'd a letter from NYSEG stating the PSC would not allow them to change my meter. When i was talking to the PSC i asked them why they wouldn't allow a new meter to be installed. They informed me the PSC has no control over NYSEG'S equipment. It is entirely up to NYSEG when to change a meter.

Appr. 4 months and the saga continues. These crooks want an increase.

I might also add the old meter would register more usage at night when everybody is asleep and very little power was being used that during the day when more power was being used. However when they installed the second meter the old one started running better that it had before. hhhmmmm
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/11/09 08:42 PM

A simple question. I had 4 NYSEG employees tied up trying to justify not changing my meter for a total of appr. 4 hrs. NYSEG paid Salary times 4 verses a $25.00 meter. what would have been the cheaper way for NYSEG to go.
Posted by: vamp

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/12/09 10:38 AM

Ok...here is my 2 cents...I have family that work for NYSEG higher paid employees with many years and low paid one as well. Guess what?? They all pay the increase too and it is hard for them as well. I think if you have to worry about your family member possibly electricuting themselves everytime they go and work 18 hour days to restore power to thousands of people in all types of weather conditions maybe it wouldnt be so easy to trash them. To talk garbage because they get a meal???? Are you serious??? As far as I am concerned they dont get paid enough sometimes. And if you see them with a hour of down time I say GREAT they deserve it. With the high winds we are having I am sure you would like a prompt and knowledgable crew to come to your rescue. Ok I feel better!
Posted by: jojotaxpayer

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/12/09 03:35 PM

That's a good NYSEG story, it's funny that you called the PSC and it made them jump. I'll have to remember that, good to have someone to back you up against them, it's like fighting goliath.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/13/09 07:48 AM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
... The highest bill was for 4,865 kwh for 1 month.


I might also add the old meter would register more usage at night when everybody is asleep and very little power was being used that during the day when more power was being used.



How many major appliances do you have?

Do you have a day/night meter?

What is the amps of your main panel? (100, 150, 200 amps)
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/13/09 04:35 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
... The highest bill was for 4,865 kwh for 1 month.


I might also add the old meter would register more usage at night when everybody is asleep and very little power was being used that during the day when more power was being used.



How many major appliances do you have?

2 refrigerators, 1 freezer, 1 Electric Clothes Dryer,

Do you have a day/night meter?

I'm not sure what you want here,but i am assuming it is from my statement about power usage between day and night. I know my usage because i take my meter readings both morning and night time. I have also taken readings several times during the day. I used common sense in thinking power usage should be down at night as everybody is sleeping.

What is the amps of your main panel? (100, 150, 200 amps)

100 amp


i'm not sure if this answers your questions or not. If not ask again and i will try to answer you. Please also bear in mind according to NYSEG own estimates based on appliances in the home. The most i could draw would be Appr.1,660 kwh per month.

A litttle more info it is a two story 3 bedroom home with appr. 1,200 sq. ft. Not very big at all.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/14/09 10:09 AM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau


I'm not sure what you want here,but i am assuming it is from my statement about power usage between day and night. I know my usage because i take my meter readings both morning and night time. I have also taken readings several times during the day. I used common sense in thinking power usage should be down at night as everybody is sleeping.




A day/night meter reads what you use during the day and charges a higher price for the day usage. The meter also reads seperately what you use at night and charges a lower price. You may not have one if you only have a few appliances and do not use electricity to heat the home.

You could turn off one circuit breaker at a time to see which circuit is drawing the most electricity as the meter would slow down when the breaker is turned off.

From the information that you have supplied it is impossible to use over 4,000 per month.

Is this a condo, multi-dwelling building or can some else tap into your electric?
Posted by: convince me

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/14/09 06:44 PM

This from this morning's Democrat & Chronicle:

"Regulators file to dismiss RG&E, NYSEG rate hikes"

Jim Stinson - Staff writer - February 14, 2009

Rate increases for the 1.8 million upstate customers of Rochester Gas and Electric Corp. and New York State Electric and Gas Corp. hit a bump Friday when state regulators filed a petition to dismiss the requests.

RG&E and NYSEG officials say credit is so tight that infrastructure improvements and repairs have had to be delayed, necessitating the higher rates.

But the staff of the state Department of Public Service said the two Rochester-based utilities haven’t made their case.

The four separate rate increase requests - one by each utility for electricity customers and the same for natural gas customers - have rankled the state regulators, who point out that parent Energy East Corp. agreed not to ask for a rate increase for 13 months after a September 2008 order allowing Iberdrola SA of Spain to buy Energy East for $4.56 billion.

Now, facing an economy they could not have predicted, RG&E and NYSEG officials said they need to exercise a provision in the Iberdrola-Energy East agreement that allows an emergency rate increase request if reliability of service is threatened.

Matt Maguire, a spokesman for the utilities, said their financial positions have been weakened to the extent that such a threat to safe and reliable service has become real.

"That's why we are filing now," he said.

Maguire declined to comment on the state's petition to dismiss.

The dispute seems to center on the definition of financial chaos. The utilities say the financial world changed last fall when the credit markets seized up and the stock market went into freefall. They have some support from business leaders, who note the recession has caused costs and investment losses to skyrocket.

"Everything started to tank" in mid-September, said Sandy Parker, chief executive of the Rochester Business Alliance. She said she backs the increase in delivery rates, although she calls it "support, not a celebration."

RG&E and NYSEG "haven't had a rate increase ... in over 10 years," said Parker. "They have to deliver quality service and be there no matter what happens."

The companies' credit rating is BBB, which increases borrowing costs. They also say their cash reserves are dwindling, and they could face a shortfall totaling $900 million by the end of the year.

Parker said the rate increases would help RG&E and NYSEG gather resources to make repairs and infrastructure improvements. She said Iberdrola has been supplying RG&E and NYSEG with cash to cover ongoing expenses.

So why shouldn't the Spanish utility giant keep doing so until the 13-month period is over?

"They need something that is sustained," Parker said. "They're not necessarily just looking for a one-shot influx of cash. Their costs ... are not one-shot things." Such costs include personnel, health care, pensions, investment losses and capital requirements.

Company officials also note that they have lowered rates twice since 1996, and that the increases they seek would return rates to 1996 levels.

But the September agreement remains a sticking point with state leaders not involved with the regulatory process.

Sen. Charles Schumer, D-N.Y., and Gov. David Paterson recently urged regulators to kill the rate request, with Schumer saying the utilities are "trying to pull a fast one on customers."

"This rate hike application reeks of profit mongering," Schumer said. "The PSC should reject this application without any hesitation." He said RG&E and NYSEG have failed to show that higher rates are essential.

The five-member Public Service Commission hasn’t yet scheduled a meeting to take up the request to dismiss the application.

JFSTINSO@DemocratandChronicle.com

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=200990214001
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/14/09 08:13 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau


I'm not sure what you want here,but i am assuming it is from my statement about power usage between day and night. I know my usage because i take my meter readings both morning and night time. I have also taken readings several times during the day. I used common sense in thinking power usage should be down at night as everybody is sleeping.




A day/night meter reads what you use during the day and charges a higher price for the day usage. The meter also reads seperately what you use at night and charges a lower price. You may not have one if you only have a few appliances and do not use electricity to heat the home.

You could turn off one circuit breaker at a time to see which circuit is drawing the most electricity as the meter would slow down when the breaker is turned off.

From the information that you have supplied it is impossible to use over 4,000 per month.

Is this a condo, multi-dwelling building or can some else tap into your electric?



Thanx BZ: No i only have one meter. Right now i have two meters,but they are hooked in together. Funny part of that is when they installed the second meter lord behold my usage took a nose dive and even the old meter started running better. hhmmm

As to the circuit breakers i already did it.I also turned my main breaker off in the box and checked the meter and it wasn't turning. I thought maybe i had a short between the meter and my Breaker box. When NYSEG was here i had them check they couldn't find nothing. My service box is only 2 years old.

Nobody has taped my line.

For general info i just got my first full months bill since the second meter was installed. I used 1,006 kwh for the month. Grant you no air cond. are running, but even if i gave them 300kwh that is still only 1,306 kwh per month. That is what NYSEG said they would use a month.

I have an old meter that has the disc in the center that turns according to how much power is being used. The meter tech said the more power that is being pulled the faster it turns. I stood there and watched this disc and at times when very few appl. are in use it would spin like crazy. Other times when all the appl. were in use it turned very little. Some times it doesn't turn at all with power being used.

I think NYSEG'S problem maybe they don't want to admith their meters are capable of over billing or running fast. Just my impression i got from them.

But i urge anybody who thinks they are being over billed check your meter and start calling your utility and demand they check your meter. If they tell you our meters will only stop if they go bad. DON'T BELIEVE THEM. I f you can't get nowhere with them call the Public Service Comission @ 1-800-342-3377. But keep in mind you first have had to attempt to resolve your issue with your utility provider.

Don't just sit bak. Even if in the end you still get screwed at least you did your best and the PSC is aware of it.

If the PSC doesn't satisfy you e-mail the Governor Patterson and make them aware of your problem. I did and i have no problem in e-mailing the Whitehouse. Remember they put their pants on the same way we do. Just be careful of your wording or you may have secret police checking you out. No threats of any kind. But damn it let them know. Believe it or not the Whitehouse does respond. I'm still waiting to see about the Governors Office.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/15/09 06:52 AM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
Thanx BZ: No i only have one meter.


Just to clarify my above post. A day/night meter is only one meter but it seperates the usage between day and night.

Your meter is not working properly as by your description. It should be abvoius to NYSEG (as they have admitted) that you cannot use 4,000 per month with only a 100 amp service. I would ask for a credit for the overbilling.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/15/09 05:46 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
Thanx BZ: No i only have one meter.


Just to clarify my above post. A day/night meter is only one meter but it seperates the usage between day and night.

Your meter is not working properly as by your description. It should be abvoius to NYSEG (as they have admitted) that you cannot use 4,000 per month with only a 100 amp service. I would ask for a credit for the overbilling.


Have asked,but i think they are more worried about having to admit their meters are capable of over charging as they went out of their way to say so. If the PSC realizes this they may force NYSEG to start checking all meters. I think that is their biggest concern. I have owned my home for 30 years and the electric meter has never been changed or checked for accuracy.

Until now
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/16/09 04:53 AM

Do they still have the second "test" meter connected?
Is the "old" meter inside near the main panel box?
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/16/09 08:40 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Do they still have the second "test" meter connected?
Is the "old" meter inside near the main panel box?


Outside at the meter box. They put a double socket into the meter box on the house and pluged the two meters into the socket.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/17/09 06:23 AM

How long do they plan on leaving the 2nd meter?
Are the meters reading the same amount per day?
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/17/09 06:25 AM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
It should be abvoius to NYSEG


obvious not abvoius --typo
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/18/09 10:37 AM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Natural gas trading near $4.476 down from over $14.
When will the customers see their natural gas rates drop the same percentage?


Natural gas trading @ $4.155 or about a 70% drop from the high.

Will NYSEG lower our natual gas by 70%?


.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/18/09 12:04 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Natural gas trading near $4.476 down from over $14.
When will the customers see their natural gas rates drop the same percentage?


Natural gas trading @ $4.155 or about a 70% drop from the high.

Will NYSEG lower our natual gas by 70%?


.


No they won't. I was talking to a friend who called NYSEG and complained of high Natural Gas bill. NYSEG told him Natural Gas isn't cheap. When is somebody going to do something with these people. Talk about greed.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/18/09 12:13 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
How long do they plan on leaving the 2nd meter?
Are the meters reading the same amount per day?





Thought this would be easier than trying to explain.

The meters have differed by up to appr. 30kwh, However it is sometimes high and sometimes low. It has been averaging out in a 30 day period within 10kwh. As i said before the old meter has been running better since the new one was attached. hhhmmm
Posted by: Senecamom

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/18/09 12:56 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Natural gas trading near $4.476 down from over $14.
When will the customers see their natural gas rates drop the same percentage?


Natural gas trading @ $4.155 or about a 70% drop from the high.

Will NYSEG lower our natual gas by 70%?


.


No they won't. I was talking to a friend who called NYSEG and complained of high Natural Gas bill. NYSEG told him Natural Gas isn't cheap. When is somebody going to do something with these people. Talk about greed.


Don't they store gas in the salt caverns, that they bought at lower prices?
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/18/09 02:19 PM

Originally Posted By: senecamom
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Natural gas trading near $4.476 down from over $14.
When will the customers see their natural gas rates drop the same percentage?


Natural gas trading @ $4.155 or about a 70% drop from the high.

Will NYSEG lower our natual gas by 70%?


.


No they won't. I was talking to a friend who called NYSEG and complained of high Natural Gas bill. NYSEG told him Natural Gas isn't cheap. When is somebody going to do something with these people. Talk about greed.


Don't they store gas in the salt caverns, that they bought at lower prices?


I never heard of it,but i wouldn't doubt it neither.

The worse part is Cayuga and Seneca counties are amongst the richest in Natural Gas wells. But we still pay an inflated price for it.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/18/09 05:45 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau


Thought this would be easier than trying to explain.

The meters have differed by up to appr. 30kwh, However it is sometimes high and sometimes low. It has been averaging out in a 30 day period within 10kwh. As i said before the old meter has been running better since the new one was attached. hhhmmm



You would think that it would be easier just to put in a new one as you asked prior. $25
Posted by: case a beer

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/24/09 09:54 AM

HEY NYSEG,

I just opened my bill and

MY BRAIN JUST EXPLODED!!!!!
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/24/09 09:55 AM

And they have even raised the rates yet.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/26/09 09:31 AM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
And they have not raised the rates yet.
typo
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/26/09 09:33 AM

Received our bill. The temperature for the past month was 5 degrees less per day compared to last year. NYSEG gave us a whoooooping $0.76 credit for the colder temperatures this year. If it was 5 degrees warmer per day bet NYSEG would be asking for more than $0.76 back to them.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/26/09 02:39 PM

Thousands of Upstate utility customers receive termination notices from National Grid, NYSEG
But National Grid, at the state's request, has shut off very few customers this year.
Thursday, February 26, 2009
By Tim Knauss
Staff writer
National Grid threatened in January to shut off electricity and gas to 100,000 Upstate customers who were late paying their bills. One out of every 15 customers across the utility's Upstate territory got a termination notice.

But responding to an appeal from the state to go a little easier on delinquent customers this winter, the utility company shut off service to just six homes last month.

At the urging of the state Public Service Commission, National Grid agreed this winter not to terminate service when the temperature falls below freezing. Formerly, the cutoff was 20 degrees.

National Grid has shut off service to just 27 customers since the end of October, compared with more than 900 during the same period a year ago. But the number of customers who received shutoff notices in January was up more than 60 percent from a year ago.

National Grid isn't the only utility struggling to collect payments.

New York State Electric & Gas sent nearly 103,000 final termination notices in December, targeting at least one-tenth of its customer base. The utility sent another 90,000 shutoff notices in January.

Courtney Quatrino, speaking for National Grid, said the utility has made special efforts this winter to negotiate payment arrangements and to refer customers who are eligible for the federal Home Energy Assistance Program.

"Shutting people off is a last resort," Quatrino said.

Utilities typically wait for mild weather to do the bulk of their service terminations. During May 2008, National Grid shut off service to more than 10,900 households.

For all New York utilities combined, service terminations climbed roughly 19 percent in 2008 from the year before. Officials at the state Public Service Commission feared this year would be even worse. As winter approached, they met with utilities and urged them to try to avoid shutoffs.

The effort appears to have worked. The question now is whether there are thousands of customers due to be shut off as soon as warm weather arrives.

"I can't speak to that," Quatrino said. "What I can say is, that just gives us more time to work with people."

PSC officials urge customers who are struggling with their bills to contact their utility, said James Denn, speaking for the commission.


http://www.syracuse.com/business/index.ssf?/base/business-14/1235642265151050.xml&coll=1
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/26/09 02:56 PM

in my own battle with NYSEG. I rec'd a notice today from the PSC. They have decided to send my complaint into a hearing. They gave me three choices to choose from.

1) Informal Hearing: This is where i meet with NYSEG in front of a informal hearing officer and present our side and try to negotiate with NYSEG. This to be done at the PSC office.

2) Conference call: Basicly the same as above, but it is conducted by phone.

3) Informal review: This is where all statements and evidence is submitted via mail and a decision is given based on the records.

Along with this is also a list of rules and rights for the hearing process.

We haven't decided which way to go at this point.

If nothing else i should be able to obtain all responses from NYSEG to the PSC. I am very interested in how NYSEG could report what they have. But at any rate just thought others maybe interested in the process.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/26/09 03:19 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
in my own battle with NYSEG...


You may be able to get an electrician to see how many amps you are drawing from the power line to see if it matches with the meter reading.

Have the 2 meters been reading the same usage?

.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/26/09 03:26 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
in my own battle with NYSEG...


You may be able to get an electrician to see how many amps you are drawing from the power line to see if it matches with the meter reading.

Have the 2 meters been reading the same usage?

.



The old meter still runs up to 30kwh different. But because one day the old meter runs fast than the next it runs slow. So in the end it still comes within 10kwh of the new meter. But even at that it still does not prove the old meter was running correctly during the time in question. juat as an added note my power usage is down to appr. 1000 kwh per month. with very little differance in the house appliances. From 4800 to 1000 with no explanation. Watch your meters.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/26/09 03:29 PM

You may want to video tape both meters at the same time to show the difference in operation. That way you will have proof for the PSC.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/26/09 04:11 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
You may want to video tape both meters at the same time to show the difference in operation. That way you will have proof for the PSC.


That would be a good idea,but knowing my luck somebody would steal it on me. lol \:\/
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 02/27/09 07:47 AM

You would only need to video a short time period to show that the meters both run at different speeds. 5 minutes of video would be enough.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/07/09 01:47 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
Originally Posted By: bluezone
You may want to video tape both meters at the same time to show the difference in operation. That way you will have proof for the PSC.


That would be a good idea,but knowing my luck somebody would steal it on me. lol \:\/


Has NYSEG figured out your problem yet?


.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/07/09 08:24 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
Originally Posted By: bluezone
You may want to video tape both meters at the same time to show the difference in operation. That way you will have proof for the PSC.


That would be a good idea,but knowing my luck somebody would steal it on me. lol \:\/


Has NYSEG figured out your problem yet?

No NYSEG has had no contact with me for some time. It has all been getting done tthrough the PSC.



.




It has now been set up for an informal hearing via conference call. I have also requsted a copy of the case file. No date has been set yet. Both myself and NYSEG will submit evidence by mail before the hearing.

At this point no matter how it works out, at least i didn't back down and i will carry it as far as possible.

Even to an appeal afterwards if possible.
Posted by: justaxme

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/08/09 09:22 AM

I have had a couple bad experiences (the ONLY experiences) with NYSEG. Both residential and commercial. They immediately take the opposite view. NYSEG can't be wrong. They act as though they are on another planet and have no clue about the real world. They are taught one thing and one thing only "The customer is always wrong". Keep BSing them and maybe they will go away. I will also be filing a complaint with the PSC this week against NYSEG.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/08/09 10:19 AM

Originally Posted By: justaxme
I have had a couple bad experiences (the ONLY experiences) with NYSEG. Both residential and commercial. They immediately take the opposite view. NYSEG can't be wrong. They act as though they are on another planet and have no clue about the real world. They are taught one thing and one thing only "The customer is always wrong". Keep BSing them and maybe they will go away. I will also be filing a complaint with the PSC this week against NYSEG.




Good for you. Maybe if enough people start complaining something might get done. Once you file you may want to ask the PSC for a copy of ALL NYSEG replies to the PSC. I caught them lieing to the PSC. However the hearing will only decide on the high bill issue.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/10/09 01:02 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau

No NYSEG has had no contact with me for some time. It has all been getting done tthrough the PSC.



.



Have your electric readings/bills gone down?


.
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/10/09 01:13 PM

Everyone with a complaint should file it with the PSC.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/10/09 04:32 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau

No NYSEG has had no contact with me for some time. It has all been getting done tthrough the PSC.



.



Have your electric readings/bills gone down?


.


Absolutely. Since the new meter was added my usage droped. Last two bills my usage has been appr. 1,000 kwh for the month. Down from 4,800 in one month. Even if i add an extra 300 kwh for a.c. that they calulated it would use. Still only 1,300kwh.
Posted by: Emerald53

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/12/09 01:53 PM

I think all of use could reduce our usage (and our bill) by at least 9 percent by being more careful with our electric usage. Turn off lights when not in use, turn off the computer, even unplug some appliances.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/12/09 03:19 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau

Absolutely. Since the new meter was added my usage droped. Last two bills my usage has been appr. 1,000 kwh for the month. Down from 4,800 in one month. Even if i add an extra 300 kwh for a.c. that they calulated it would use. Still only 1,300kwh.

Sounds like NYSEG owes you a large refund if they made you pay the overbillings.
Posted by: justaxme

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/14/09 05:05 AM

NYSEG is clueless. They screwed up AGAIN and I just got a 12 PAGE BILL to explain their screw up!!! I am going to have to hire an electronics engineer with a minor in rocket science to weed thru this BS bill. I may get Mike Nozzolia's office, along with the PSC, involved this time. This is BS!!!
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/14/09 02:48 PM

Originally Posted By: justaxme
NYSEG is clueless. They screwed up AGAIN and I just got a 12 PAGE BILL to explain their screw up!!! I am going to have to hire an electronics engineer with a minor in rocket science to weed thru this BS bill. I may get Mike Nozzolia's office, along with the PSC, involved this time. This is BS!!!


I agree. I didn't give Nozzolio a thought. Thanks maybe i'll give him a call.
Posted by: reilley

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/14/09 05:23 PM

go get tham buzzards! They are nasty,nasty people. If I was that nasty to people , I couldn't sleep at night.
Posted by: justaxme

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/14/09 07:43 PM

Originally Posted By: reilley
go get tham buzzards! They are nasty,nasty people. If I was that nasty to people , I couldn't sleep at night.


I think Nozzolio needs to know when an inefficient monopoly, who cares nothing about their customers, abuses the power (no pun intended!!).

Without getting into a long story, it's like a bank you've done business with for years, screws up the math and bounces your check, even though there was plenty of money. AND STILL EXPECTS YOU TO PAY A BOUNCED CHECK FEE!!! Again, they are always right and the customer is always wrong, so no need to listen to them.
Posted by: Sweetcakes

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/14/09 08:47 PM

I guess i get my turn to deal with them Mon.. Just got a bill for just under a grand..My monthly bill usually runs around 350!!!!
Posted by: Della

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/14/09 09:35 PM

Originally Posted By: reilley
go get tham buzzards! They are nasty,nasty people. If I was that nasty to people , I couldn't sleep at night.


I agree. I got a termination notice from them for $13.00 one time. I can't think of 1 good thing to say about NYSEG.
Posted by: reilley

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/14/09 10:39 PM

Ha! I know that feeling , I had gotten a very large sum of money a couple of years ago. Everything had cleared so there was no holds on any of the money... I wrote a check for $10.00, it bounced,I had over $30,000 in the bank and it BOUNCED !!!! I went to Auburn and blew my top.... they tried to blame ME! I Then started making calls in front of the manager, she said she would take care of it asap,in 10 min, I had the ck fee back in there and everything was set. 20 minutes later I walked out of the bank with $35,000 and went to a different bank... they were so pissed ,They wanted to give me a check I said no ...
They even tried to call my hubby but he wouldn't answer the phone(he had no idea who it was).. The next bank was suprised to see me with all that cash.
So Yes banks can be nasty too,but gees I found a bank that was great to me.
Posted by: Phit

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/14/09 11:42 PM

I have had problems with banks in the past, but when I went into credit unions I found peace.
Posted by: *Sparkey*

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 06:46 AM

Originally Posted By: Della
Originally Posted By: reilley
go get tham buzzards! They are nasty,nasty people. If I was that nasty to people , I couldn't sleep at night.


I agree. I got a termination notice from them for $13.00 one time. I can't think of 1 good thing to say about NYSEG.


They are crazy people..my Jan bill..$450.00..then my Feb..$1888????..so I pay $1800..they were knocking on my door for the $88..then I get a bill last week that says it is $1600..it says that when I paid the $1800 the bill was really $2600..and the new charges are $800..NO WAY..I will be calling tomorrow!
Posted by: Della

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 09:11 AM

Good God!
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 09:29 AM

I'm on the budget. NYSEG estimates my usage higher than my actual usage. I pay every month on time and then I get a bill for a little over $1000.

I will be calling them Monday as well.

Definitely going to make a complaint with the PSC.
Posted by: justaxme

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 09:34 AM

Originally Posted By: Taxpayer14456
I'm on the budget. NYSEG estimates my usage higher than my actual usage. I pay every month on time and then I get a bill for a little over $1000.

I will be calling them Monday as well.

Definitely going to make a complaint with the PSC.


I hate the budget. I pay as I go. If the bills are to high, I just turn down the heat. And in the summer I am rewarded with $35-$45 bills. I read every other month. I am not loaning NYSEG any money!!!!
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 09:49 AM

I found it easier. I am re-thinking that tho. Usually in February in the past I have paid $0 up to a couple hundred and change to play catch up.

Now I get a bill for a little over $1000.

I just did a little on-line research and there are alot of complaints made about the same thing as i'm experiencing.
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 09:50 AM

Here you go folks:


http://www.dps.state.ny.us/

File your complaints.

This many people experiencing the same problem all can't be wrong.
Posted by: justaxme

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 10:13 AM

Originally Posted By: Taxpayer14456
I found it easier. I am re-thinking that tho. Usually in February in the past I have paid $0 up to a couple hundred and change to play catch up.

Now I get a bill for a little over $1000.

I just did a little on-line research and there are alot of complaints made about the same thing as i'm experiencing.



I'm curious. Is $1000 for your home? I have a 2500 sq ft home and my worst might be $400.
Posted by: reilley

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 11:08 AM

holy my god, are you guys kidding? I thought my daughter was joking when she said her bill was 800.00. temp is down,no lights except 4 hrs a nite.... Boy I think the phone wires are gonna be hot tomarrow
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 01:40 PM

Originally Posted By: justaxme
Originally Posted By: Taxpayer14456
I found it easier. I am re-thinking that tho. Usually in February in the past I have paid $0 up to a couple hundred and change to play catch up.

Now I get a bill for a little over $1000.

I just did a little on-line research and there are alot of complaints made about the same thing as i'm experiencing.



I'm curious. Is $1000 for your home? I have a 2500 sq ft home and my worst might be $400.



Yes just for my home.

All this and they still want 9% on top of that.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 01:46 PM

Originally Posted By: *Sparkey*

They are crazy people..my Jan bill..$450.00..then my Feb..$1888????..so I pay $1800..they were knocking on my door for the $88..then I get a bill last week that says it is $1600..it says that when I paid the $1800 the bill was really $2600..and the new charges are $800..NO WAY..I will be calling tomorrow!


Was the Feb bill estimated by NYSEG?
If so, then I would start calling in your readings on the months that NYSEG does not read it.
Posted by: Sweetcakes

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 06:57 PM

Im not on the budget..My g&e usually runs about 350. My tenants also had the same problem. Theirs usually runs about 300 They got a bill for 600.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 09:59 PM

Originally Posted By: Taxpayer14456
Now I get a bill for a little over $1000.


Is this just for electric or gas/electric?

.
Posted by: SkySoldier

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 10:05 PM

Mine runs about 45 to 80 bucks a month ... depending on the season.

I use more electricity in the winter as my wood stove has one electric motor to power the hot air blower, and the coal stove has three; one for exhaust, 1 for controlling the coal flow, and 1 for the blower.

I paid $350 for coal ... and cut my own firewood. Ny cieling fan runs year round in two different modes.

With repairs on saws, gas and oil ... my wood, besides a really good summer's workout, cost me $150.00.

Water is heated by elctricity, stove runs on the same. .... I keep most lights off unless in use and pretty much have music playing 24/7.

I have a small fridge that has one third of its structure devoted to freezer, and a stand up freezer in the basement. both well stocked with game taken during hunting season.




I also have a full tank of propane for the forced air furnace that has not been touched in years. ;\)
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 10:15 PM

Originally Posted By: SkySoldier
I paid $350 for coal ... and cut my own firewood. Ny cieling fan runs year round in two different modes.


How much coal do you normal use in a winter?
How many cords of wood per winter?
Posted by: reilley

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/15/09 10:18 PM

HA I JUST SAW THIS ...

Schumer: Investigate NY electric rates
By: The Associated Press

Sunday, March 15, 2009 9:44 AM EDT

ALBANY -- U.S. Sen. Charles Schumer is calling for an investigation of what he says are unnecessarily high electricity rates in New York caused by deregulation of the industry, citing a study that a trade group calls seriously flawed.
The Democrat pointed to a recent report that says New Yorkers pay about 10 percent more in their bills than they should and face higher bills than residents and businesses in neighboring states. However, the industry says the report is deeply flawed in its data and analysis and New Yorkers are paying less because the industry is regulated more by market forces than government.

"New York's energy auction system needs to come out of the shadows before New Yorkers have to needlessly shell out another nickel to power generators who could be gaming the system to reap profits at consumers' expense," Schumer said. He said New Yorkers are paying as much as $2.3 billion more annually than necessary under a secretive auction process in which an industry-created group sets rates.

Gavin Donohue of the Independent Power Producers of New York, a trade group for generators, said New York's rates are far lower, accounting for inflation, than when the industry was regulated more by government a decade ago. The high cost of natural gas and other fuels masks the savings and New York's high taxes, environmental protection fees and undersized transmission system also add substantially to New Yorkers' bills, he said.

Donohue said the current system puts more risk and costs on shareholders rather than on rate payers. He said it also has drawn more competition into New York, brought more reliability to the system in an era when blackouts can cost New Yorkers $10 million a day, and created an incentive for more wind and other cleaner power sources.

"It's a complicated subject and there's no problem discussing it because we have a great story to tell," Donohue said. "But this commodity is unlike any other commodity. You can't store it and you need it when you need it."

At issue is an "auction" system used to set rates by the industry's Independent System Operator. The ISO is now being reviewed by the Assembly. Assemblyman Richard Brodsky of Westchester called the price-setting system a form of collusion by the industry.

Operators say the process works this way: Power producers using fossil fuels, hydro, wind or nuclear power submit bids on a price for the megawatt hours available at a specific time. Those prices range from zero — for producers with excess power to unload — to $1,000 per unit. The ISO could choose the lowest bidder, but when that generator's units are expended, the ISO moves to the next highest bidders, in order, until all the megawatts needed are secured. Each time the ISO moves to a higher bidder, all of the lower bidders are paid the price offered in the highest bid used.

Schumer said these auctions must be monitored more closely to make sure bidders aren't strategically withholding power to increase the price.

"I am hoping that the new administration will energize (the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission) to once again be the cop on the beat to protect energy consumers and to investigate potential threats to operating the most efficient and fair energy markets," Schumer said.

He cited a recent report by energy expert Robert McCullough that concluded the price of power was 10 percent higher than it should be in New York and much higher than in many other states.

Donohue said the report is flawed because only 15 of 300 plants were studied and the 11-page report didn't accurately evaluate the massive, $10 billion industry and the unique challenges in New York. Among them, he said, is the state's failure to increase the number of transmission lines for natural gas to provide cheaper fuel to power plants.

But Schumer says New York's high rates are part of why the number of residential accounts terminated for nonpayment was recently reported by utilities as 329,817, up from 277,771 in 2007.
Posted by: SkySoldier

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/16/09 12:30 AM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: SkySoldier
I paid $350 for coal ... and cut my own firewood. My ceiling fan runs year round in two different modes.


How much coal do you normal use in a winter?
How many cords of wood per winter?


I use the coal stove primarily for back up for my wood stove ... or to supplement it through the very cold days of winter.

When the temps settle down into the single digets, the wood stove cannot keep it warm enough upstairs for comfort. Nothing will freeze up, but, unless I want to deal with 45 degrees in the main living areas and my third floor loft/bedroom/bath ... I have to burn coal to back up the wood burner.

The coal stove is in the main living room on the 2nd floor.

I have a Stoker Coal Burner. So I can fill the hopper and leave for 3 to 5 days, depending on the setting and the outside temps. The colder outside, the higher the setting and so the more coal I must use for the heat to keep up.

It will be cold inside, but will not be freezing.

I bought a ton of coal from Holden, in Ovid this year ... and still have 800 pounds left over. So far.

Wood takes me all summer to gather, zipped into 18" lengths, and split using a hand mall and wedges.

I started with 7 rows of split hardwood. Each row measured 6 feet high, 18 inches wide and 25 feet long.

As needed, I fill the wood room in the finished basement. This room has a concrete floor, concrete block walls, is unfinished and directly adjacent to the wood stove.

I built a trap door under my deck that leads directly into the wood room. Thereby keeping the debris from firewood inside the house restricted to that room, and around the wood stove.

It's a constant cleaning of both the stove to prevent chimney fires and to keep up with the wood debris.

The dust from both the coal and the wood is killer. It's a filthy way to heat ... but saves me thousands on oil or gas heat.
I would guesstimate I use ten to 15 full cord a year. A cord is what? 4' wide X 4' high X 8' long? So that sounds about right.

I start stacking wood in the late spring and do wood all summer long; as soil conditions allow me into my woods to retrieve downed trees.

I have yet to had have to cut down a live tree for firewood.

With about 30 acres of wood lot, enough dies off, or is downed by storms, that there is always an abundance of hard wood like black cherry, oak, silver maple and, mostly, ash either standing dead or downed to be harvested to burn.

But living alone, it's a lot of work ... worth it for the savings but you cannot NOT get up and toss a couple logs on the fire if you expect to make it through the winter without the pipes freezing up. I have lived here for ten winters now and have yet to freeze my plumbing.

I have, however, had to deal with several chimney fires over the years. I put them out by firing 200 grains of black powder in my .50 caliber TC Fire muzzle loader UP the chimney through the plug in the bottom under the main deck.

It not only puts the fire out instantly, it cleans ALL the creosote out from top to bottom.

Since the wood stove is in the basement, and the chimney is 25 feet of triple wall that runs up through the roof, I repeat the procedure two or three times a winter to keep the chimney clean while burning.

( I let the wood stove go out for maitanance - unless there's fire at the top of the chimney ... and then it's "git r done" time.)


Short answer ... I use about a ton of coal and 12 to 15 full cord of mixed hardwoods from early September to mid-May each year.
Posted by: justaxme

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/16/09 05:24 AM

I am sure they are screwing us over BIG TIME, it's just a matter of HOW!! The whole industry from Natural gas to propane are screwing us all the way to the bank.
Posted by: justaxme

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/16/09 05:40 AM

We are sitting on one of the largest Natural Gas Fields (Marcellus Shale) in the world, but hear little about it. I am sure energy companies lobbyists with the help of government are now planning on how to screw us over on this too!!

http://geology.com/articles/marcellus-shale.shtml

In early 2008, Terry Englander, a geoscience professor at Pennsylvania State University, and Gary Lash, a geology professor at the State University of New York at Fredonia, surprised everyone with estimates that the Marcellus might contain more than 500 trillion cubic feet of natural gas. Using some of the same horizontal drilling and hydraulic fracturing methods that had previously been applied in the Barnett Shale of Texas, perhaps 10% of that gas (50 trillion cubic feet) might be recoverable. That volume of natural gas would be enough to supply the entire United States for about two years and have a wellhead value of about one trillion dollars!
Posted by: jojotaxpayer

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/16/09 06:41 AM

This could help explain why we are getting robbed.

Investigation into possible over charging.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/16/09 09:35 AM

New Yorkers may be $2.2 billion a year too much for power because of a bidding process that allows power generators to artificially inflate prices, according to U.S. Sen. Charles Schumer.

Schumer, D-NY, on Sunday called for a federal investigation into the bidding and auction process used by the New York Independent System Operator -- the entity responsible for pricing power to the state's utilities.

Schumer called on the head of the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission to investigate whether NYISO's power auctions were subject to price-fixing or bid-rigging, according to a news release from Schumer's office. The power auctions must be monitored closely by government regulators to ensure that bidders aren't withholding their supplies to increase the price, the news release said.

New York state electricity customers pay much more for power than elsewhere in the United States -- behind only Hawaii and Massachusetts, according to the U.S. Energy Information Administration. Energy expert Robert McCullough found the price of power across New York was 10 times higher than it should be , Schumer said.

Schumer wants the results of FERC's investigation to be made public within 90 days.




---------------------------------


Did I read it to be 10 times higher or is this a typo?
Sure would like my NYSEG bill to be 1/10 of what it is now ;\)

Would also help to bring in new businesses from out of state

.

Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/16/09 10:32 AM

NYSEG is a joke and so is their so called customer service.
Posted by: justaxme

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/17/09 06:50 AM

I have delayed my PSC complaint until wednesday when the weather won't be so nice. I hate to ruin a nice day by calling NYSEG.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/18/09 07:01 PM

Originally Posted By: SkySoldier
I started with 7 rows of split hardwood. Each row measured 6 feet high, 18 inches wide and 25 feet long.


Sounds like you make a good pile during the summer months.

Originally Posted By: SkySoldier

It's a filthy way to heat ... but saves me thousands on oil or gas heat.


With the land that you have available have you ever thought about installing a geothermal heat pump?
If you have or know someone with a backhoe then installing the underground pipe would cut the major upfront costs.

Dig the trench, bury the pipe and then backfill.
You could use the geothermal as your main source and then use the wood/coal as a back up.

Just a thought to save from stocking the wood fire.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/18/09 07:07 PM

Originally Posted By: reilley
Gavin Donohue of the Independent Power Producers of New York, a trade group for generators, said New York's rates are far lower, accounting for inflation, than when the industry was regulated more by government a decade ago. The high cost of natural gas and other fuels masks the savings and New York's high taxes, environmental protection fees and undersized transmission system also add substantially to New Yorkers' bills, he said.


The price of natural gas has dropped from a high of $15 to trading at $3.687 just today.

My recent NYSEG bill showed that my electric rate went down $0.02 per kilo and my nat gas went down $0.01 per therm.

Far more room to drop to reflect the drastic drop in nat gas over the past year.
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/19/09 11:11 AM

Everyone should be burying NYSEG with PSC complaints. Then maybe someone will take notice.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/26/09 09:28 AM

Did I hear that they were going to freeze the rates for a year?
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/26/09 09:56 AM

I didn't hear that. They will probably want the 08 rates frozen because they were higher.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/28/09 03:30 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau

No NYSEG has had no contact with me for some time. It has all been getting done tthrough the PSC.
.

Have your electric readings/bills gone down?
.

Absolutely. Since the new meter was added my usage droped. Last two bills my usage has been appr. 1,000 kwh for the month. Down from 4,800 in one month. Even if i add an extra 300 kwh for a.c. that they calulated it would use. Still only 1,300kwh.


Makes me curious how many other customers have a bad meter but it is not this apparent?
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/29/09 11:48 AM

Bury NYSEG in complaints to the PSC.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 03/31/09 08:39 AM

Originally Posted By: reilley
go get tham buzzards! They are nasty,nasty people. If I was that nasty to people , I couldn't sleep at night.



they may come after with comments like that.
Posted by: Peloquin

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/07/09 01:45 PM

NYSEG, RG&E rate increase request dismissed by PSC


Update: The Soup Nazi says "NO SOUP FOR YOU!"

Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/08/09 10:04 AM

Natural gas trading down near $3.62 down from $14. Did your natural gas bill go down?
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/08/09 10:16 AM




Good for the PSC. It's about time NYSEG got slapped.
Posted by: justaxme

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/08/09 11:29 AM

Originally Posted By: Taxpayer14456



Good for the PSC. It's about time NYSEG got slapped.


They not only have lousy customer service:

"NYSEG and RG&E have BBB-level ratings, which is lower than all other utilities in the state, which carry A-level ratings."

http://www.timesunion.com/AspStories/story.asp?category=&storyID=788101&BCCode=&newsdate=4/8/2009
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/08/09 11:55 AM

Probably because they just don't care since they have been screwing us for many many years.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/15/09 12:44 PM

Hello its me again. I had my informal hearing via phone conference. With the PSC and NYSEG. The idea was to come to some agreement with NYSEG or the PSC would rule. No agreement was reached. I was asked by the PSC would i wanted. I replied a new meter and some kind of adjustment on the electric bill. NYSEG refused both. As it came to light the meter was appr. 30 yrs. old ( as we have owned our home that long and i don't recall it ever being changed ) the PSC asked why they wouldn't change the meter. NYSEG said they refuse to change the meter.

The conference lasted about 45 min. in the end the PSC says they have trouble believing a meter can stop and start on its own. As i pointed out i had recorded ove 133 meter reads but they were only my word. at that point i will probably lose.

However the PSC asked NYSEG how old the meter was they didn't know. The PSC asked if NYSEG would change the meter NYSEG said no. So NYSEG is telling the PSC were to go.

The decision is pending.

I found it hard to believe NYSEG is so powerful they refuse to listen to the PSC. Or is it NYSEG is using me to get even with the PSC?
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/15/09 12:59 PM

Of course they don't want to change the meter. If it's mis-reading high then that's good for them.

Keep the faith. Keep fighting.
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/15/09 12:59 PM

Everyone who has had the slighest problem should bury NYSEG in complaints to the PSC.
Posted by: Herewego

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/16/09 12:45 PM

We as the consumers will never see any credit, they are to busy coming up with new ways to stick it to us! In this ecomonmy one would think that the utility companies would be lowering their rates as so many poeple are without a job, foreclsoures are rising higher each day, etc., etc.

The better question is WHY NYSEG is being allowed to jack up the services that we all need but do not have a choice in companies. Wow... so much for CHANGE!
Posted by: *Sparkey*

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/16/09 01:11 PM

What ever you do DON'T pick Columbia for your company...I have had bills up to $900.00 a month!!
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/19/09 08:55 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
The conference lasted about 45 min. in the end the PSC says they have trouble believing a meter can stop and start on its own. As i pointed out i had recorded ove 133 meter reads but they were only my word. at that point i will probably lose.

However the PSC asked NYSEG how old the meter was they didn't know. The PSC asked if NYSEG would change the meter NYSEG said no. So NYSEG is telling the PSC were to go.

The decision is pending.



Did you mention that it impossible for you to use the amount of electricity as stated by the NYSEG crew?

Any mechanical device will not run perfectly forever as parts wear out.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/21/09 09:27 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
The conference lasted about 45 min. in the end the PSC says they have trouble believing a meter can stop and start on its own. As i pointed out i had recorded ove 133 meter reads but they were only my word. at that point i will probably lose.

However the PSC asked NYSEG how old the meter was they didn't know. The PSC asked if NYSEG would change the meter NYSEG said no. So NYSEG is telling the PSC were to go.

The decision is pending.



Did you mention that it impossible for you to use the amount of electricity as stated by the NYSEG crew?

Any mechanical device will not run perfectly forever as parts wear out.


Yes i did.

I agree but NYSEG has the PSC believing that a Electric meter when it gos bad will only slow till it stops. Therefore not over charging the consumer. That may hold true with a water or gas meter where there is a flow to turn the gears of a meter. However on an electric meter it depends on elecictric coils to determin the speed of the meter. That is why there are adjustments that can be turned to adjust the meters speed. it is capable of running fast and i am waiting on info i sent for to prove that point. Hopefully when this goes to appeal it will convince the PSC to put tighter testing and replacement rules in place. That will benefit everbody if NYSEG is made to replace more often.

I don't know what the other Utilites practice is on replacing Elestric meters. You can call your utility and ask. You can also ask how old your meter is.

We are all being ripped off.

Food for thought. Gas pumps are tested by weights and measures to ensure accuracy. Maybe they need to randomly check utility meters. Maybe we should all start talking with our elected officials.
Posted by: reilley

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/21/09 09:31 PM

now that sounds like a great idea but WAY TO MUCH WORK for NYSEG ! If they have to put effort in to something... last yr.they replaced electric wires that were 50+ yrs old and replaced rotted poles on the road where I am. They left the old pole up next to the new one. its been a year now and it was to be taken down when the new went up.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/21/09 09:53 PM

Maybe they think they are planting a tree. lol Maybe they will wait for it to fall so you have to clean it up. I know it is reinforcement for the new one.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/21/09 09:55 PM

You know it is the workers that hear it and it is corporate greed behind it. The fat cats are sitting in their cushy chairs laughing all the way to the bank.
Posted by: reilley

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/21/09 11:44 PM

I am just waiting for this months bill .... 2 mo ago,elec was $92.00 then it was $20.00 , Now ... I am just waiting ... can't imagine what cause that drop but I am sure I will pay dearly for it.
I am not complaining yet. I finally said screw it got off the the stupid budget,that was more of a headache.
and I found out that when you are on the budget, its on your credit report... because you have a outstanding bill ,if its 10 bucks or 1000.00., they never tell ya that.
Posted by: Yetta Nother

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/22/09 07:49 AM

I had the pleasure of speaking to NYSEG yesterday......their customer service is at its worst.....the people there are rude and unhelpful.....when I ask questions they tell me that they don't know what to tell me. How about telling me why my electric bill is so high.....there's a start. I would love to know how to contact the PSC.....I will write them a letter tomorrow. Everyone should send mass quantities of mail to them. What makes them think they never have to maintain their equipment? They actually told me to hire someone to look at it....ahahahaha...imagine that? It's your damn meter.....you come and look at it! NYSEG is sucking the life out of people and they don't care. They have you by the balls.
Posted by: Senecamom

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/22/09 07:55 AM

http://www.dps.state.ny.us/


New_complaints_disputes.htmlThe Office of Consumer Services provides direct and timely assistance to consumers in resolving disputes with utilities. The Office also provides statistical information with regard to customer complaints and analyzes customer concerns and brings them to the attention of the Commission. There are several ways that consumers can contact the Department with complaints, inquiries or comments about their utility service:

On-line: You can file a complaint or review complaint statistics comment on Commission proceedings, or Ask-A-Question about your utility service
By Telephone: Helpline (general complaints and inquiries): 1-800-342-3377 (8:30 am - 4:00 pm) Competitive Energy Hotline complaints about Energy Service Companies: 888-697-7728 (8:30 am - 4:00 pm) Hotline for terminations of gas or electric service: 800-342-3355 (7:30 am - 7:30 pm)
By Mail: Office of Consumer Services, NYS Department of Public Service, 3 Empire State Plaza, Albany, NY 12223
Call Center

Information regarding filing a complaint about your utility service, complaint determinations and Complaint Statistics.

PSC Comment Form
We want to know what you think about utility issues!
Posted by: justaxme

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/22/09 08:12 AM

Originally Posted By: Yetta Nother
I had the pleasure of speaking to NYSEG yesterday......their customer service is at its worst.....the people there are rude and unhelpful.....when I ask questions they tell me that they don't know what to tell me. How about telling me why my electric bill is so high.....there's a start. I would love to know how to contact the PSC.....I will write them a letter tomorrow. Everyone should send mass quantities of mail to them. What makes them think they never have to maintain their equipment? They actually told me to hire someone to look at it....ahahahaha...imagine that? It's your damn meter.....you come and look at it! NYSEG is sucking the life out of people and they don't care. They have you by the balls.


Well said. I will be filing a complaint with the PSC this week. NYSEG is horrible and we have the highest utility rates in the country. You think they would worship us!!!
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/22/09 09:50 AM

I don't think any of us would put up with this type of customer service at a restaurant, store, valet parking or anything for that matter.

Everyone should bury NYSEG with complaints to the PSC.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/22/09 12:22 PM

Amazingly enough when NYSEG installed the second meter my Electric usage droped from 4800 kw a month to 880 kw a month. What will happen if they remove the second meter and leave the old one? Thats why i'm fighting the removal till NYSEG agrees to a new meter.

I'm not a lawyer, but isn't it Fraud when they charge you for Electric you didn't recieve.
Posted by: Yetta Nother

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/22/09 12:37 PM

I would think that it would be and that they should have to credit you. Amazing a new meter and it registers lower. I am more convinced than ever that they are taking advantage of us....and getting away with it. Why won't anyone listen?
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/22/09 04:21 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
... However on an electric meter it depends on elecictric coils to determin the speed of the meter.


Is the dual meter still connected?

When power is interupted (car hits a pole, tree limb falls on power lines, squirrel shorts out the transformer...) and NYSEG turns the power back on there is usually a power surge that will effect the accuracy of the meter. Over a thirty year period the meter would lose its accuracy.

An electrician should be able to measure the power coming into the home and see if the meter is operating properly.
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/23/09 11:32 AM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
Amazingly enough when NYSEG installed the second meter my Electric usage droped from 4800 kw a month to 880 kw a month. What will happen if they remove the second meter and leave the old one? Thats why i'm fighting the removal till NYSEG agrees to a new meter.

I'm not a lawyer, but isn't it Fraud when they charge you for Electric you didn't recieve.



I would venture a guess that NYSEG knows older meters read higher and that's why they don't want to install new ones.
Posted by: poohbear66

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/23/09 11:58 AM

I know there are problems since I just recieved a bill rfom them that is 3times higher then any of my bills have been in the last 12 yrs. I called them and complained. They are suppose to send out someone to look at my meeter since in 12 days it says iI used over 294 watts already. With no-one home all day and heat and hot water not on electric , I need some explaining to be done.
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/23/09 12:30 PM

Seems like there is a lot of that going on. File a complaint with the PSC.
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/23/09 12:51 PM

Make your complaint on line and you will receive an email letter like this;

This letter acknowledges your recent contact with our Office
of Consumer Services regarding your concern with New York State
Electric & Gas Corp. and to advise you of the process by which this matter will be addressed.

Since New York State Electric & Gas Corp. did not previously
resolve this matter to your satisfaction, we have escalated your
concern to senior staff at the company. We directed them to contact you and resolve the matter you brought to our attention. By the time you receive this letter, you should have spoken with a company representative to discuss your concerns and provide you with a resolution or a date by which the company expects to resolve your concern. We have advised the company to reach a resolution with you as soon as possible.

If you have questions regarding the company's response to
you, please contact the designated senior staff person at New York State Electric & Gas Corp.. If the company has not contacted you with its initial acknowledgement, does not resolve your concern within two weeks or by the date it promised a resolution, or if you are dissatisfied with the company's response, you should contact us at 1-800-342-3377 for a complete investigation of the matter. If you report back to us that you are dissatisfied with the company's response, we will initiate an investigation and report our findings
to you.

If you have any questions regarding this process, please
contact our office at 1-800-342-3377 and refer to Case Number.

Sincerely,

Robert Crespo
Office of Consumer Services

PLEASE NOTE: If you are not satisfied with the response you receive
from New York State Electric & Gas Corp., please contact us at
1-800-342-3377 for an investigation.




Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/23/09 12:52 PM

But then don't expect the follow-ups on behalf of NYSEG to be in a timely fashion.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/23/09 02:51 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
Amazingly enough when NYSEG installed the second meter my Electric usage droped from 4800 kw a month to 880 kw a month. What will happen if they remove the second meter and leave the old one? Thats why i'm fighting the removal till NYSEG agrees to a new meter.

I'm not a lawyer, but isn't it Fraud when they charge you for Electric you didn't recieve.




Nyseg was here today and removed both meters and left another meter in their place ( New Meter ) . I was told by the tech. they maybe back to reinstall the old meter at a later date.

I got into a discussion with the tech. and asked what physicly turns the gears in a electric meter. He informed me the current turns them. After a few more minutes of discussion it was admitted by the tech there are electric coils in the meter that determins its speed. When i questioned how long these coils are expected to last he said they never go bad. According to him Electric coils never wear out. I'm not that stupid.

After he left i called the PSC to let them know NYSEG removed the meters.

Does NYSEG believe people are STUPID?
Posted by: Yetta Nother

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/23/09 03:15 PM

Yes....they think we're all stupid. I am curious to know how much your power goes down now with a new meter.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/24/09 08:38 AM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
... When i questioned how long these coils are expected to last he said they never go bad. According to him Electric coils never wear out.


Coils fail everyday. There are coils in your cell phone charger(transformer). Have you ever had a cell phone charger go bad? There are coils in your car. They also fail. The power supply of you computer has coils. Has your computer power supply ever gone bad? ...

NYSEG should start making coils for many other applications if they think coils do not fail.


I would take a daily meter reading to see if this newer meter is giving you a better measurement.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/24/09 09:28 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
... When i questioned how long these coils are expected to last he said they never go bad. According to him Electric coils never wear out.


Coils fail everyday. There are coils in your cell phone charger(transformer). Have you ever had a cell phone charger go bad? There are coils in your car. They also fail. The power supply of you computer has coils. Has your computer power supply ever gone bad? ...

NYSEG should start making coils for many other applications if they think coils do not fail.


I would take a daily meter reading to see if this newer meter is giving you a better measurement.


I know they do and i agree. I take reading several times. When we had the hearing NYSEG had about 12 readings i had 133. However the PSC says the readings are only my word. It will be fought out in the appeal. There was no sense in arguing at that point. Besides NYSEG pi-- the PSC off when they refused to change the meter.

After they removed the meters I called the PSC to make them aware of what was happening and they said they would order a full report on the meter from NYSEG.
Posted by: Yetta Nother

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/25/09 07:40 AM

....and when it is found to be the meter.....then what? If your meter readings start to now go down.....where does that leave the rest of us......or the overcharged money?
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/25/09 07:41 AM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
I take reading several times.
Is the new meter showing that your daily usage is less than the old inaccurate meter?

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
Besides NYSEG pi-- the PSC off when they refused to change the meter.

It sounds like NYSEG knows the old meter is bad but does not want to admit it.

This will not correct your current situtation but NYSEG reads our meter every other month. To stay current, I read our meter on the months that NYSEG does not read it and then I call it in thru their automated system (1-800-600-2275). Ask them to send you a meter reading card in the mail and it will tell you when the meter needs to be read and how. If an error is found than it can be dealt with before another month passes.


If you talk with the PSC ask them when our gas and electric rates will go down as natural gas is trading at about $3.27 down from a high of over $14. Will the customers see a 75% drop in their bills? I think that this is a 20 year low for natural gas prices. News reports show that a large natural gas supply has been found.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/25/09 08:34 PM

Originally Posted By: Yetta Nother
....and when it is found to be the meter.....then what? If your meter readings start to now go down.....where does that leave the rest of us......or the overcharged money?



They already did go down. Soon as the second meter was installed my usage did a nose dive from 4800 to 890 a month.

The second meter was new why didn't they leave that one. I asked and i was told he was instructed to install another new one. mmmmmm

Makes you wonder what the second meter was controlling?

As to where does it leave everyone else. We all need to get in touch with our State Senators and start demanding a tighter control on the Utilites and a set time they can leave a meter in service.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/25/09 08:35 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
I take reading several times.
Is the new meter showing that your daily usage is less than the old inaccurate meter?

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
Besides NYSEG pi-- the PSC off when they refused to change the meter.

It sounds like NYSEG knows the old meter is bad but does not want to admit it.

This will not correct your current situtation but NYSEG reads our meter every other month. To stay current, I read our meter on the months that NYSEG does not read it and then I call it in thru their automated system (1-800-600-2275). Ask them to send you a meter reading card in the mail and it will tell you when the meter needs to be read and how. If an error is found than it can be dealt with before another month passes.


If you talk with the PSC ask them when our gas and electric rates will go down as natural gas is trading at about $3.27 down from a high of over $14. Will the customers see a 75% drop in their bills? I think that this is a 20 year low for natural gas prices. News reports show that a large natural gas supply has been found.


Thanx for the suggestion, but i enter my reads on-line instead of them estimating.
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 04/28/09 02:16 PM

Instead of raising what they are already overcharge they should start by eliminating the sub-standard help. The CEO should go to a job site, see first hand the two guys watching the guy in the hole who is actually digging and fire the two on the spot.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 05/16/09 08:53 AM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau

Thanx for the suggestion, but i enter my reads on-line instead of them estimating.


How long have you been reading your meter?
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 06/19/09 10:15 AM

I like how they bill you for issuing you a bill. There is a bill issuance charge of 89 cents.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 06/19/09 04:22 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau

The second meter was new why didn't they leave that one. I asked and i was told he was instructed to install another new one. mmmmmm


Did they refund you any money?
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/12/09 07:05 PM

Originally Posted By: Taxpayer14456
I like how they bill you for issuing you a bill. There is a bill issuance charge of 89 cents.



Subtract 89 cents for paying the bill.
Variable electric rate is around $0.043
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/13/09 09:22 AM

NYSEG needs deregulation. The whole voice your choice is a joke.

NYSEG needs some real competition.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/14/09 07:26 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau

They already did go down. Soon as the second meter was installed my usage did a nose dive from 4800 to 890 a month.

The second meter was new why didn't they leave that one. I asked and i was told he was instructed to install another new one. mmmmmm



Did they give you a refund?
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/15/09 10:42 AM

Too bad NYSEG can't give us just a 9% increase in customer service satisfaction.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/15/09 11:17 AM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau

They already did go down. Soon as the second meter was installed my usage did a nose dive from 4800 to 890 a month.

The second meter was new why didn't they leave that one. I asked and i was told he was instructed to install another new one. mmmmmm



Did they give you a refund?




No
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/15/09 11:31 AM


I recieved the decision from the PSC and it went pretty much the way i thought. Nyseg removed the meters from my house and a month later the PSC inspected the meter. As PSC said the gears looked new. Probably because nyseg rebuilt the meter prior to PSC inspecting it. I don't believe a meter over 30 yrs old would look new. I asked NYSEG to leave the meters on the house till after the dispute was settled in that way i would know the meter wasn't repaired before inspection, but NYSEG pulled it any way.

I had took over 300 meter reads and had recorded a differance of up to 24 kilowatts in a 48 hr. period. However the PSC informed me that they were my readings and they only had my word for the accuracy and refused to consider them.

The PSC in their decision made excuses for NYSEG saying that the Usage chart was only an estimate of average usage, NYSEG figured maximum usage per appliance. NYSEG even claimed if my sump pump fell over it could have been stuck in the on position and figured its usage for a 30 day period running 24/7. NYSEG returned to my home twice more to make sure they had figured everything in.

In the end i can only appeal if i had new evidence, why bother the PSC won't allow it.

I might get better results by going to the Governor or Senator, but that's doubtful.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/15/09 01:02 PM

Did the PSC have an answer as to why the house was using more electric than the appliance could demand?
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/15/09 05:30 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Did the PSC have an answer as to why the house was using more electric than the appliance could demand?




none
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/15/09 07:21 PM

There usually is a small adjustment screw on the front of the meter to calibrate it. NYSEG could have simply adjusted it prior to the PSC checking it. It sounds wrong how the PSC handled it. The PSC should have had an individual come and look at the defective meter while it was in operation on your home.
Posted by: Taxpayer14456

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/16/09 09:28 AM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
I had took over 300 meter reads and had recorded a differance of up to 24 kilowatts in a 48 hr. period. However the PSC informed me that they were my readings and they only had my word for the accuracy and refused to consider them.



How about taking the reading then taking a picture of the meter showing the same reading. Log all the readings in a calendar book or something similar.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/16/09 11:29 AM

A camcorder should have given the PSC valid prof.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/16/09 10:48 PM

Originally Posted By: Taxpayer14456
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
I had took over 300 meter reads and had recorded a differance of up to 24 kilowatts in a 48 hr. period. However the PSC informed me that they were my readings and they only had my word for the accuracy and refused to consider them.



How about taking the reading then taking a picture of the meter showing the same reading. Log all the readings in a calendar book or something similar.



While photos sound good i don't think it would have changed anything, because i proved my readings were accurate by asking nyseg for a reading from them and i gave them the date and approximate time nyseg took the reading. NYSEG also took random readings without my knowledge and mine were the same as theirs.

I just had alot more of them.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/16/09 10:59 PM

My way of getting even with NYSEG is by looking into alternative power screw them. Pull the plug
Posted by: The Mask

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/17/09 08:18 AM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
My way of getting even with NYSEG is by looking into alternative power screw them. Pull the plug


AMEN to that Dink!

You are not going to beat these blood sucking thieves! Big money brings corruption and power. The only way we can fight them is don't use them.
If you feel you can't afford alternative power, add it up and I'm sure it would pay for it's self in a year in most cases.

Posted by: The Mask

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/17/09 08:28 AM


And hide it from NYSEG I might add. They have this law going where you have to sell any extra to them, which is just another way to get in your pocket. You will have to talk with someone in the know there for the whole story, but you won't want them around.
Posted by: The Mask

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/17/09 08:51 AM


Want them to read your meter every month? Turn your gas and electric off and use alternative power. They think people can't do that and are stealing their's. hahaha

This is what I did for two years after I got estimated 3 months in a row for a thousand dollars each month. Surprisingly enough this became exactly what I used! I burt wood and never turned my furnace on. I tried to fight them but to this day I still owe them that 3,000.

So after 2 years of living without NYSEG and letting the meter lady in to check my meter "It's a law they can come any time to read their meter, and they won't take it out and cap it off." The meter Lady says to me. "WOW! Your really doing it aren't you? Good for you. I wish I could do it! You wouldn't believe my bills!" I asured her I would.
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/17/09 11:40 AM

Thanx Mask and i agree completely. We have found several ways of producing our own electric. If you don't mind telling me what you use for electric. Any information from anyone would be greatly appreciated. As to natural gas for heat, we are usualy gone for the heating season. It snows we GO. lol
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 07/17/09 11:43 AM

It was really sad to listen to the hearing because NYSEG was in complete control of that hearing. I do have to admit i did get a new meter. I really expect NYSEG to put the old one back on for spite.

The PSC was arguing for the utility.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 08/10/09 10:03 PM

Originally Posted By: The Mask
"It's a law they can come any time to read their meter, and they won't take it out and cap it off."


We have the gas/electric turned off on the cottage when not in use.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 08/10/09 10:04 PM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau


The PSC was arguing for the utility.


Then the PSC should change their name.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 08/25/09 08:51 AM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
I do have to admit i did get a new meter.


Did they make you pay for the high electric bill?
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 08/25/09 02:48 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
I do have to admit i did get a new meter.


Did they make you pay for the high electric bill?


All $2,000.00 i haven't paid it and won't.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 08/26/09 07:39 AM

Was this from just one month of usage?
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 08/26/09 02:57 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
Was this from just one month of usage?


No a three month period. It took that long to get them to do something with the meter.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 08/26/09 07:22 PM

They have no explantion as to why it went down with the new meter?
Posted by: Dinky Dau

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 08/29/09 07:00 PM

Originally Posted By: bluezone
They have no explantion as to why it went down with the new meter?


NONE
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 09/02/09 08:28 PM

They changed the meter and the readings went back to normal. How many clues do they need?
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 09/04/09 12:50 AM

Originally Posted By: Taxpayer14456
Too bad NYSEG can't give us just a 9% increase in customer service satisfaction.



Will NYSEG pass along this lower price to their customers?

Gas May Drop From Seven-Year Low to Less Than $2, Options Show

By Reg Curren and Dinakar Sethuraman

Sept. 4 (Bloomberg) -- Natural gas futures are poised to fall further after trading at the lowest in seven years in New York as stockpiles grew to a record for this time of year, according to options data and analysts.

The cleaner-burning fuel, down 56 percent this year, may plunge another 20 percent to below $2 per million British thermal units as new liquefied natural gas supplies come on stream, said Tony Regan, a consultant for Singapore-based Tri- Zen International. Trading of bearish options on the U.S. Natural Gas Fund rose to a record as investors bet that the exchange-traded fund tracking gas futures will keep tumbling.

“I would not touch that market until I see a $1 handle in the next month,” Jonathan Kornafel, a director for Asia at options traders Hudson Capital Energy. “The fundamentals are just too strongly bearish for this thing to turn around.”

Natural gas for October delivery fell 0.3 percent to $2.501 per million British thermal units at 10:10 a.m. Singapore time on the New York Mercantile Exchange. The contract declined 7.6 percent yesterday to settle at $2.508, the lowest close since March 5, 2002.

Supplies of gas rose 65 billion cubic feet in the week ended Aug. 28 to 3.323 trillion cubic feet, the Energy Department said. Inventories are the highest for that week since the department began publishing data in 1993. New LNG projects in Qatar, Yemen and Indonesia, which may reach capacity in 2010, coupled with weak Asian demand may send supplies to the U.S.

Puts Surge

Volume for puts, giving the right to sell the ETF, rose yesterday to 220,165 contracts, or 2.6 times the four-week average, as options traders bought the contracts to protect from a further drop if the fund extends its 61 percent slide this year. Puts traded 1.4 times more than calls, which give the right to buy the shares.

“LNG is going to put further downward pressure on Henry Hub,” Regan, who formerly worked for Royal Dutch Shell Plc, said in an interview. “We could go lower than $2, it hasn’t finished yet.” Demand hasn’t increased in Europe, and U.S. domestic output has been higher than expected, which will put further pressure on Henry Hub, the U.S. gas benchmark, he said.

Overall U.S. gas consumption may contract by 2.6 percent as the recession that began in December 2007 cuts demand, the Energy Department said in its monthly Short-Term Energy Outlook on Aug. 11.

Gas use at factories is forecast to tumble 8.6 percent this year because of the recession, the department said. Stockpiles typically gained 64 billion cubic feet for the period in the past five years.

‘Little Demand’

“We’re well supplied and there’s so little demand,” said Michael Rose, director of trading at Angus Jackson Inc. in Fort Lauderdale, Florida. “Some people are starting to question the economic recovery and that adds more pressure to gas.”

Natural gas for delivery in January settled at $4.819 per million Btu, a premium of about $2.311 to October futures. When prices for future delivery are higher than near-month contracts it’s a situation known as contango, which typically encourages companies to put supplies in storage now for use later.

October 2009 $3 call options were the most active natural gas options yesterday, based on Nymex electronic trading data as of 3:31 p.m. They fell 7.5 cents to 8 cents.

October 2009 $2 puts, the second-most active, rose 1.8 cents to 5.2 cents and were followed by the $2.50 puts, which gained 6.9 cents to 23 cents.

The $2 put, which became available on March 11, was trading at its highest price ever yesterday and has risen from a contract low of 0.8 cent reached on Aug. 6 as futures declined 33 percent.

Storage Shortage

“We’re getting to the point where people are starting to worry about where they’re going to put gas and what that entails for the market,” said Brad Florer, a trader at Kottke Associates Inc., a commodity futures broker in Louisville, Kentucky. “If they have to take gas to market, instead of putting it in storage, the front end of the curve will continue to get whacked.”

Peak natural gas storage capacity rose 100 billion cubic feet to an estimated 3.889 trillion cubic feet as of April as operators expanded to meet rising production, according to an Energy Department report on Aug. 31.

The previous high for storage is 3.545 trillion cubic feet, reached on Nov. 2, 2007, according to the department.

“The physical aspect of the commodity is becoming a problem, unless some demand comes on quickly or we get some weather that changes things,” said Florer. “As long as those things remain constant, like they have for months now, then I don’t think the bulls have much to hang their hats on any time soon.”
Posted by: natron717

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 09/06/09 07:18 PM

This is why all monopolies are to be resisted...and all of them result from government regulation! (In a true free market, a monopoly can be challenged and undercut. Try doing that to NYSEG, USPS, MEDICARE, etc. when they have tax subsidies.)
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 19 % increase. - 09/24/09 09:03 PM

Are they now asking for a 19% increase?
Posted by: Laurence

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 09/26/09 11:46 AM

If you like the 9% increase NYSEG is asking for - - you'll love Obama's Cap and Trade program...... look for at least $1400 increases on each homeowner ... on top of that 9 % increase....

http://www.taxfoundation.org/publications/show/24472.html

Calculate what it might cost you here:
http://www.taxfoundation.org/capandtrade
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 11/13/09 06:14 AM

Originally Posted By: Dinky Dau
My way of getting even with NYSEG is by looking into alternative power screw them. Pull the plug


saw some solar panels for sale on CL
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 11/13/09 06:15 AM

Is NYSEG going to eliminate the "voice your choice" program?
Posted by: ponyk

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 11/13/09 09:39 AM

sure and work this morning we were told pay freezes at least the next 2yrs. and the price of our insurance went up..great way to look at next year early
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/12/10 07:19 AM

Wonder how this months bill will look?
Posted by: Mountain Man

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/12/10 07:55 AM

bluezone, I have contacted windtamer. Go to their webstie...very cool...I have an estimate coming...able to go off the grid.


http://www.windtamer.com
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/12/10 08:00 AM

I saw them on YNN as they have installed their first unit and expect more to follow. Be curious to find out the size and the price.
Posted by: Mountain Man

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/12/10 02:53 PM

They gave me a price of $17,500. The tax incentives total 50%, so the cost isn't much more than a good whole house back up generator system. The plus is you get to sell electricity back to the utility as well. Gotta love that! We are going to meet with them to see if we can negotiate a bit. I really want to move on this. Nothing would be better than being off the grid.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/13/10 07:38 AM

how many kilowatts is the unit?
Posted by: Mountain Man

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/13/10 07:59 AM

http://www.windtamerturbines.com/windtamer-turbines/request-a-quote/windtamer80gt2000/
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/13/10 08:07 AM

Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
The plus is you get to sell electricity back to the utility as well.


NYSEG would probably only give you $0.02 per kilowatt
Posted by: Mountain Man

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/15/10 04:28 AM

It still seems reasonable to me...just a little more than back up generation. I am concerned about the reliability though...need to go see it in action.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/17/10 03:00 PM

Did they give you a "life span" of the unit?
Posted by: Mountain Man

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/17/10 04:35 PM

no, we havent met face to face yet. They have a 6 year warranty ...which mean a lot to me....but we'll see once we are eye-to-eye.
Posted by: Mountain Man

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/17/10 04:35 PM

no, we havent met face to face yet. They have a 6 year warranty ...which mean a lot to me....but we'll see once we are eye-to-eye.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/18/10 06:50 AM

Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
They have a 6 year warranty


Hopefully the pay back is less than 6 years.
You may want to ask which parts are more likely to fail first and the cost to replace.
Posted by: bluezone

Re: NYSEG asking for a 9 % increase. - 01/18/10 06:52 AM

Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
The plus is you get to sell electricity back to the utility as well.



If NYSEG gives you a low buy back price you may be able to ask you neighbors if they want to buy the electricity from you at a reduced price.